Cyprus And EU Bailouts
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2013-03-21/cyprus-and-eu-bailouts
Political leaders in Cyprus are in crisis talks. They face the collapse of their banks and are looking desperately for a way to avoid that prospect. The European Union could help with a bailout fund, but only if Cyprus puts in $13 billion. The financial sector accounts for 40 percent of the Cypriot economy, and without outside aid, it’s likely to fail. Cyprus’s financial ties to Russia would widen the impact. But critics of the proposed bailout say ordinary citizens would end up paying. Meanwhile, the banks in Cyprus remain closed. Please join us to discuss what the current crisis in Cyprus means for the rest of us.
Guests
Nicholas Schrifin
correspondent, ABC News
Sheila Bair
senior adviser at The Pew Charitable Trusts and former chair of Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation.
Jacob Kirkegaard
research fellow at the Peterson Institute and senior associate at Rhodium Group, a New York-based research firm.
Nicholas Karambelas
legal counsel for the American Hellenic Institute.
Comments
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Wealth confiscation is not coming, it's here.
California Seeks Retroactive Taxes From Business Owners
A state appeals court had ruled unconstitutional a provision that required companies to maintain 80 percent of their workforce in California in order to qualify for the break.
Instead of consulting the state legislature, the board suspended the break entirely and is seeking back taxes totaling $120 million from some 2,500 business owners
http://www.newsmax.com/US/california-retroactive-tax-levies/2013/03/19/i...
California Proposition 30, Sales and Income Tax Increase (2012)
Prop. 30 will increase personal income tax for seven years on Californians earning more than $250,000. It will be implemented retroactively, starting Jan. 1, 2012. Those earning between $250,000 and $300,000 will pay 1 percent more. People making between $300,000 and $500,000 will pay 2 percent more, and people making more than $500,000 will pay 3 percent more in taxes.
I am so looking forward to this topic Thursday.
We will hear the words tax and levy.
Will we hear the words confiscation, theft, stealing, etc.?
"earning more than $250,000. It will be implemented retroactively, starting Jan. 1, 2012. Those earning between $250,000 and $300,000 will pay 1 percent more. People making between $300,000 and $500,000 will pay 2 percent more, and people making more than $500,000 will pay 3 percent more in taxes."
Damn, if we could only get that implemented nationally!
Teece Bowman wrote:"Damn, if we could only get that implemented nationally!"
Liberal tax the rich revenge aside, government theft is still theft. These policies will do little to balance California's budget but they do it anyway. This is a toe in the water.
DEREGULATE- DEFRAUD-DENY... This policy has been implemented all over the world...
Argentina,Bolivia,Iceland,the Eurozone,California,Ohio,the United States... Only a partial list of victims.
#1 fastest way to bankrupt a country or State..TAX CUTS
#2 replace cash or Treasury notes in treasuries with worthless instruments like derivatives.
#3 fraud.just steal the cash like Argentina,or Enron`s fraud in California,or like S&L`s fraud nationally.
Then the cool part.Taxpayer dollars bail out the crooks,mostly Wall Street bankers. Then New crooks, mostly other Wall Street bankers (IMF),offer to loan us money to tide us over. Their Deal.. give us a ZERO tax rate,ALL your Trust Funds,and your property and assets,like the Parthenon,the Coliseum,your public parks, ALLthe Washington Monuments.. Ya got to love Bolivia. The Bankers got the water works. Even the rain belonged to the Bankers..
DEREGULATE-DEFRAUD-DENY...The policy enacted for the crooked Wall Street bankers,sold to politicians by lobbyists as the way to do good business and enjoy growth.Lobbyists paid by the Wall Street banking crooks.
If the richest people in the world were taxed at 95% of what they have, they would still have more than 95% of us. You may call that revenge, I would call it simply rational and ethical. I think you equate ethical with theft.
But monte, you know as well as I, that the wealthy have no ethics. You must be wealthy, eh? If not I wonder why you are being a tool for them?
This is how the US got into the problems that we are currently in. It began with Reagan, and the Republicans (who have made no taxes a mantra) have dug us into this hole. Cyprus, Iceland, the EuroZone, the USA, the problem is the same.
I think that folks in the US would agree (maybe) to spending cuts in exchange for having the wealthy pay out considerably more than they currently do. In this country, I think that the Kennedy era tax rate of 65% sounds like a damn good start.
I suspect that the Cypriots would agree....(again maybe)
Teece Bowman wrote: "If the richest people in the world were taxed at 95% of what they have, they would still have more than 95% of us. You may call that revenge, I would call it simply rational and ethical. I think you equate ethical with theft"
Seems you're in some kind of rut, how did 250K become the richest? This is small business operating territory. I'm told the backbone of the economy, NO? The money needed to support government spending and it's growth, can hardly be touched by taxing the rich at the fullest possible amount, their going to come after us sooner or later.
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/income-inequality-in-america...
Look at the graph. Go after the richest folks and it will be quite a while before they get to us. Stop listening to Rush Limbaugh. He definitely doesn't want you to be thinking about how much money he has.
@ Blueneck BillyBob:
Don't worry BBB the big "O" has a solution... PRINT MORE MONEY!!!!!
OPINION SOUGHT?
What number qualifies something as being reasonably described "as a whole", 60%, 70%, 80% ?
"in general" could be substituted for "as a whole", so what would that be, 60%, 70%, 80% ?
"as a whole"
Definition
when considered as a group and not in parts:
The population as a whole is getting healthier.
If FDR were alive he'd be anxious to show Teece Bowman his stamp collection. FDR's compromise has prolonged dying corporate Capitalism in the USA for almost a century now. See, FDR convinced the 1% that if they didn't accept high tax rates and pay for their opportunity to accumulate the social contract would be voided and the economy would collapse from being hollowed out. The bankers and potentates he appointed knew little of Keynesianism but they sensed real danger and most of them compromised. A 95% tax bracket is far better than Revolution or Fascism. Of course a minority of Big Bidnessmen attempted a coup (testimony before Congress of Gen. Smedley Butler) but FDR was like Obama and he never prosecuted these traitors. (He should have sent them to prison for life.) (Google-Economic Update with Rick Wolff for March 16th)
In the face of Reality, using your pitiful household budget or a Constitution written by Owners (Funding Fathers) as a model is a fool's errand. See, the main purpose of our Gubment is to protect the rich few from the poor many, and now it assists those rich few with Austerity (extraction). It depends upon where you sit what you think is right. I oppose 10% taken from the $10K savings account of a laboring couple hoping to buy a house but I think the wealthy hoarder and extractor owes 10% extra at least. Consider it a fee for criminal license because anyone can see how the wealthy are not subject to the same law and regulation as most people. Follow this rule: "End welfare from the top down: Deregulate from the bottom up." Levelling makes life easier for all. Show me the person worth more than $250K a year and I'll know you worship wealth and celebrity. (Shake off the brainwashing.) "You are an idiot if you perish over perverted principle when practicality is within reach." That's what FDR would say.
Teece Bowman wrote:
"If the richest people in the world were taxed at 95% of what they have... I would call it simply rational and ethical."
This, in sum, sounds like your position. If it isn't, or I have missed something please correct me. But I would be very interested to hear you expand on that in way of explanation. This is a serious inquiry. Why would this be "rational and ethical" in your ethos?
Cyprus is an offshoring center, for Russian Oligarchs, and for some Chinese and Americans too. The demand for a 10% levy by the European Union was an attempt to levy a wealth tax on competitors, just run of the mill WTO level activity. An alternate proposal would have left savings less than $110K euros intact. I could support that alternative in Cyprus, in the Caymans, Switzerland, Singapore; anywhere international pirates stash their loot. The problem in Europe is that German banks were the beneficiaries of the warlike levy. That is why a high tax rate is better than letting corporations collect illegitimate debts by force. I'd really hate to see the Marines die for Mitt Romney's bank account or Seal Team Six get mowed down making a night time withdrawal for an Oligarch. But we're getting pretty close.
When reviewing Teece's writings some of you seem to embrace the adage ,"When I want your opinion I'll give it to you." In this way you mimic the sadistic fascist manners of right wing media hosts defending their wealthy sponsors' rights of plunder. I suggest you peer into your own tiny savings accounts and consumer debts. Who would take monetary advice from indigent paupers? (You'll never be rich and you'll never host a slap-tongue talkshow.) I think Teece's critics here would be the last Americans to take to the streets defending our rights. They'd hide until a break in the carnage then slither forth to plunder the possessions of the dead and dying. I hear that subtext in their nihilist rhetoric.
Henry Potter is a character in the movie,"It`s a Wonderful Life". A Capitalist (VULTURE CAPITALIST) who takes full advantage of economic crashes. Many of these types in America are still hopping mad at Obama for stopping the complete crash of our economy. Remember,'picking winners and losers' idiocy..?? They demanded the complete crash so the can buy our assets for pennies.
HOW DARE OBAMA PROTECT AMERICA,AND CHOOSE THE PEOPLE OVER THE OLIGARCH`S (VULTURES)..??
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/03/21/cyprus-the-sum-of-all-fubar/
What can be done? First off, Cypriot banks cannot honor their debts, which unfortunately overwhelmingly take the form of deposits. So a default on deposits is inevitable.
Now, my words:
As the banks have assets 8 times the Cyprus GDP, the local government has no way to guarantee the depositors. If Europe wants to do this for this tax haven, fine, but it needs to stop the islands around Europe from doing this shady type of banking.
Pancake Rankin wrote:
"I think Teece's critics here would be the last Americans to take to the streets defending our rights. They'd hide until a break in the carnage then slither forth to plunder the possessions of the dead and dying. "
Now wait a minute! I thought that the wealthy were the ones that did that! And yet, those being accused of it here are also said to have "tiny savings accounts and consumer debts" and are "indigent paupers"!
Something doesn't compute ... or, alternatively, maybe som people's minds just spews forth hate in whatever form at those with whom they disagree, whether it makes logical sense or not.
The Europeans would be wise to dismantle the euro-zone asap. The longer they wait the worse this is going to get. These troubled countries just do not have the political courage to make the needed spending cuts. Let them again assume the responsibility of having their own currency and let them inflate their way to disaster instead of dragging everyone else with them. Problem solving is only made harder when populations can blame outsiders.
Billybob, you are correct that Barack Obama would never have become President had he not been trained like a pooch by the Owners at Harvard. Harry Potter is just as bad as Henry Potter. Remember all the spoils his parents left him. That was a way to brainwash children. It says wealth bequeaths magical powers. Maybe our Owners are crashing America on purpose, to extract every last penny. The urban Chinese population receiving $35K a year is now larger than our shrinking workforce. We are the overripe fruit ready to be juiced. Capitalists foresee consumer buds everywhere from India to the Paraguan rain forest. They think they already own every ounce of dirty shale oil, every vein of minerals and every uterus. It is our task to convince them they are mistaken. But we seem to be having trouble even with their golems writing on this page. Protectionism might be our best hope when combined with local food and self-sufficiency. The "free market" they impose on us with secret trade deals is suicide. Hail to the Pooch: Capitalist Lapdog. Any bait I use on my hook seems to attract the same old Crappies.
It really hasn't so much to do with my ethos as it has to do with simple pragmatism.
Simply reflect on what has happened, and continues to accelerate, not only within our own country, but to the world as a whole....a world that is increasingly in the hands of the wealthy. In short, it doesn't work.
Some see the nature of "wealth redistribution" as an evil....as a matter of fact the word redistribution is ranked right up there with communism, socialism, liberalism and secularism (often synonymously) with those on the right. And unless you are wealthy, or have a pretty good shot at being wealthy, I seriously question why you buy the line that it benefits you, to protect the ass of the person a rung higher than you on the economic ladder? Especially when they have their foot squarely on your hand on the rung and are worming it around.Thus, unless the wealth gets spread around, the world becomes a very ugly and brutish place.
Don't believe me, look around.
Teece Bowman wrote: "but to the world as a whole....a world that is increasingly in the hands of the wealthy. In short, it doesn't work."
Yes, "as a whole", what percentage would you put on this? give me a range.
Thanks!
It would seem that we have not learned a thing. LET THE BANKS FAIL!!! Then institute new rules against Fractional Reserves and Limited Liability (make the CEO/CFO liable for losses and for criminal prosecutions). At some point we have to stop socializing gambling losses and make those who gamble responsible for their own losses.
Stability at the price of allowing crooks and thieves get away with their crimes and our money is not stability...it is blackmail. Let those who gamble and lose pay their own debts. Why keep raping the taxpayer, savers, low wage earners to line the pockets of those who ripped them off in the first place.
It's blackmail to force the Cypriots to sell off their natural resources to pay the bank losses. Do we really want a Russian aircraft carrier in the Med? This is like the World Bank forcing countries to sell off Public assets to get a loan. It is the people who suffer in the long run while the Capitalists profit.
At some point the frantic music must be stopped and we have to rethink what we are doing. Accountability, both financial (make CEO/CFO liable for losses) and legal (make CEO/CFO liable for jail) has to be part of the system or there is no accountability at all. Socializing losses while privatizing profits is a losing game that we are caught up in. Let's see some Finance people have to sell everything and move in with their relatives. Let's see some CEO/CFOs go to jail. Then maybe we will trust government and Banks again.
Teece: You're wasting some mighty exotic nightcrawlers on bottom feeders. Why don't you and me get out to the creek and catch them barehanded, put 'em in a bucket until we can feed 'em to the hogs. (I don't think ecology is offensive, but some people will eat dirt to please a rich guy.) Maybe the time of Levelling has come. First we have to demystify money, and explore some complimentary currencies. There are means of exchange superior to greenbacks.
Peter Boyle awakens!
Peter Boyle shows courage in font.
Will Peter join his neighbors in producing their own local stability? Can he let go of the false dreams implanted in his subconscious by constant advertising? We should all ask ourselves if we can turn our backs on the Fraudsters and make their money mattress stuffings.
Note: The inane and pointless interrogation of Teece's truths by Luntzheads is a waste of time. It amounts more to nagging than examination. It borders upon bullying. They gonna spit they dentures if they don't slow down.
They say don't discuss politics or religion if you want to be polite. See below, as off-topic golems extend this adage to weather. Sometimes I see that DRShow is too polite.
It's 10 degrees in southern WI. right now, normal high is 49 degrees. What happened to global warming? AS A WHOLE, the temperatures are trending well below normal. Gee, I wish someone could help me out and tell me if I'm using "as a whole" properly. I need some percentages to describe as a whole in order to make proper mathematical conclusions.
@Peter Boyle:
It will be to the everlasting chagrin of Pancake Rankin, that I (and probably others here) agree with you 100%!
But accountability and personal responsibility must extend everywhere - including, for example, health care. If you do not carry health insurance, you accept the consequences if you get sick. We give you palliative care, because we don't want people dying in the streets - but that's it.
Socializing those kinds of losses with public assets is ALSO a losing game.
Gentleman on the program keeps talking about the Turkish invasion as related to the Cyprus EU bailout issue. Given that Greek Cypriot government has been recognized internationally, they had the opportunity to receive international aid, business, and funds.
I don't think it is fair to blame Turkey for the mistakes that Greek Cypriot Banks have made.
If Greek Cypriot government deserves compensation from Turkey, then the Turkish Cypriots deserve compensation from the Greek Cypriot Government for the suffering from 1963 to 1974. Which will make it even.
Greek Cypriot Banks flourished with money the laundering they've provided all these years.
I think we should start pointing fingers to where the actual blame is; Greek Cypriot Banks.
Thank you
freedom, you gotta stop with the accountant stuff! The world is not made to be parceled out like that.
You're like one of the blind men trying to describe the elephant (how metaphorically interesting?)
Pancake you're right, this is a waste of time. They will only learn when it all comes down....perhaps then they will see that the entire economy was only a ponzi scheme all along.
Teece Bowman wrote: "They will only learn when it all comes down....perhaps then they will see that the entire economy was only a ponzi scheme all along"
Maybe the economy will come down as a whole but not in it's entirety, what percentage should I look for to tell the difference?
Thanks!
I really wanted an opinion on this but it's obviously very subjective. One thing for sure, it does not mean a 100%