Debate Over Ways To Improve School Safety
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2012-12-19/debate-over-ways-improve-school-safety
Last week’s horrific attack inside a Connecticut elementary school has sent a wave of anxiety among parents across the country. Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut had a very good security system in place, and the teachers and staff there were well trained, but no system and no amount of training can create a completely secure environment. By every measure students are safer in school than anywhere else. Still, many parents are asking if schools in their own neighborhoods have adequate protections in place for their students: Please join us to discuss school safety.
Guests
Kenneth Trump
president of National School Safety Services.
Lucinda Roy
alumni and distinguished professor at Virginia Tech, and author of the novel "Lady Moses" and several poetry books.
Christine Bailor
safety and security coordinator for Henrico County Public Schools.
David Osher
vice president of the American Institutes for Research (AIR), AIR Institute fellow and co-director of the Human and Social Development Program.
Comments
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Maybe I'm a day late on this, but I'd love to see more focus on controlling the availability of ammunition. There is no need for teflon bullets and magazines for the general population.
Arming our schools should be discussed in light of the military base mass murder by the psychologist where there were many highly trained high level armed people at gates and in the room.
Your contributors have many good suggestions.
I would like to thank Dr. Roy for her book, and courage to remain at Virginia Tech. I had serious concerns when my children, subsequent to the 2007 shooting, decided to attend VT. My son, as a freshman last year, witnessed the crime scene of the 2011 shooting on campus of the police officer. I am comforted by the fact that faculty, such as Dr. Roy, are at Virginia Tech, and my children feel safe as members of the Hokie Nation family.
An armed guard would be a deterrent. Give vets who need jobs these positions after rigorous screening. These children would be their brother soldiers ...they would protect them.
How about a corps of retired people who are willing to spend one morning or one afternoon a week patrolling the school campus outdoors.
They don't carry weapons; but they could surely carry a transmitter that sends a direct emergency signal to both the school office and the nearest police station.
If the teachers had concealed carry, they would've had a fighting chance against the gunman....
Something also needs to be said about Big Pharma's role in their distribution of ssi drugs as a 'cure all' drug.....which it's not
As a parent of a young adult with a serious (but not violent thank God) mental illness, I would like to comment about the situation with the universities. With the privacy laws the way they are, it is next to impossible for parents to get necessary information about their children from the schools. The school is not allowed to release anything about grades or health-- things that could alert the parent that something is wrong so they could intervene. In our case, we were extremely fortunate that someone in the office of the department called us and let us know that our child was behaving strangely and they were concerned. I was able to develop a trusting relationship with the department and together we were able to manage my child's issues. I am sure I had information that legally I was not entitled to but I can not thank them enough for trusting me with the information so we could seek the help my child needed and encourage my child to take medication. This happy outcome would not have been achieved without the courage of the department to work with me. Some common sense adjustment needs to be made to these privacy laws.
So, no one is going to challenge the use of psychiatric drugs, I guess.
I can not quote exactly, but LeDoux, neurobiologist of auditory and alertness system of children pointed out that every bit of energy used to be on alert, splits attention of the child. Having to be on alert for gunmen, as well as any error they might commit against the school system, subtracts from their attention to the task. This is why abused children lose intelligence points. Frequently 50 percent of their attention is on their surroundings and planning how not to 'offend' and how to 'find cover.' Already they have to do this in the schools who are reactionary, and in the beat down mode. One has to be careful in Virginia, as they will find a way to protect their profits in guns and the prison and police system. They emotionally castrate their young.
Thank you particularly for having Ms. Roy on your program. I am a VT alumni, met my alumni husband there and our daughter was a sophmore at VT during that horrible killing spree of Seung Qui Cho 5 years ago. Thank you Ms. Roy for your book and your courage in expressing your perspective. You have were and are an exemplary professional.
I have remained focused on safe gun advocacy in our country and am a mental health professional/couple and family therapist as well. Like Ms. Roy I have seen a shift of focus of the our national willingness to take a stand for gun safety at this point.
I am committed to practice soundly and effect change for the students and their families of my alma mater(s) as well as all of our nation: to encourage all of us to handle guns safely as well as recognize our youth (many are just becoming recognized as severely mentally ill at college age) and adults who are unable to manage a deadly weapon of any type.
You are 100% right on all counts.
"urbanrage wrote:
If the teachers had concealed carry, they would've had a fighting chance against the gunman...."
You're right of course. Take away all the guns and Adam Lanza comes with a Molotov cocktail or something else. I repeat ...
When will people learn that, sadly, bad s- happens. It always has, and it always will, whether there are guns in the hands of the public or not.
AWB makes people, including legislators, feel like they're "doing something about Sandy Hook", but they're not and the statistical history surrounding the ban proves it.
clrobson wrote:
Arming our schools should be discussed in light of the military base mass murder by the psychologist where there were many highly trained high level armed people at gates and in the room.
Guns are highly controlled on military bases. At the Fort Hood shooting two civilian police officers were the first to respond. Military bases are turned into gun free zones which allowed the shooter to kill and wound so many.
I heard the comment from the mother who was sad that her children might not feel safe in school because of the red drills they do. I was in middle school in 1999 and remember practicing "lock downs". The drill was the same; the students would crowd back against the wall furthest from the door or we would get into a closet if it was big enough. Our teachers would put black paper over the windows in the doors and we would be quiet for 5 or 10 minutes until we heard over the loud speaker that the drill was over. I think children are resillient. I have no lingering fears about my childhood and no negative memories of the drills. To the students it was just like the fire drills and tornado drills we practiced two or three times per year. I imagine this is emotionally very similar to the drills students used to do during WWII. I don't know anyone who had any negaative effects or felt less safe after a drill. But I can understand that this is not what the mother imagined her children would have to deal with at school, and it would of course be better if we didn't need to practice being safe from unexpected disasters.
Unfortunately, stronger gun laws won't solve the issue of the 300 million guns that preceded stronger laws. I have a 7 and 10 year old in public schools in Ohio, strikingly similar to Sandy Hook, so 'I also have a stake' at risk.
I have listened closely, I have listened to all points --.. I have applauded and honored first responders, I have wept over the innocent. I have lost sleep over the children of Sandy Hook, Columbine, Chardon, West Nickel Mines, Red Lake and I am sure I have missed many more..... But I can no longer accept the only position of strong control, mental counseling etc- the facts remain, first responders are usually to late - 1 child, 1 teacher, 1 principal is one to many ---
If a vulenerable school is hardened with a trained armed security officer, well protected, with only 1 entrance way accessible from the outside - he can perhaps create a few precious minutes of deterrent to truly allow first responders to be more than just first ones arriving to clean up a horrible terrible tragedy, and then perhaps our society will have the time to reap the benefits of stronger bans on guns and mental health efforts.
"Banners reading "No Weapons in Campus," and "Tobacco Free Facility" are posted on the front gate of the Los Angeles Unified School District's Lankershim Elementary School"
How would a psycho killer interpret these signs? Unarmed targets without cigarettes. Too dangerous, better find a softer target.
Diane,
I agree with many of the commentators and guests, that we must move forward with discussions about how to control the awful violence we repeatedly experience in our country. However, I believe that the root of our problem is spiritual. Our nation has walked away from its Judeo-Christian roots, leaving us adrift in a world where the best wisdom we have is man's wisdom. People and societies have never been perfectly free of hate, violence, and the like, but when more people bowed their knees to the Creator in Heaven, we had more civility in our land. While we are busy trying to curb violence and help the mentally ill, we must examine our own hearts and ask God to turn us around. Thank you for posting my comments.
Here are some real statistics for you all.
According to the FBI Uniform report in 2011 8,583 people were killed by gun violence.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration reported 32,885 people killed in vehicular accidents and 2.24 million injured.
According to Medical News Today 195,000 people die from medical malpractice every year.
The reporting of shooting is sensationalism at its best. Doing away with semi-automatic assault rifles is not going to stop mentally unstable people from killing innocent people. This is a social problem not a gun problem. Let's heal our fractured families, let's heal our fractured government, let's start being parents to our children, let's get away from T.V shows that focus on conflict and arguements, let's start being civil to each other. You are focusing on one small aspect of an issue that is multidimensional. There is not a single solution and if the nation focuses on a single issue nothing will be resolved.
Finally, if assault weapons are banned there will be more purchased pre-ban than there were in private hands before the discussion started.
I agree there are weapons that ordrinary citizens don't need to own, but I don't believe the core of the problem is gun control. It is an important component, and one I support, but not the issues core. I'm from Lansing, MI, very close to Bath, MI, where in 1927 a man placed a bomb inside a school and killed 45 people, 38 of which were children. No gun involved, yet massive casualties. I see the core of the issue as making our schools secure. There will always be people trying to commit violent crimes. We sould focus on cutting off their access to these places that hold the most innocent and vunerable.
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.....Sticks and stones will leave bruises. And now, even inappropriate touching will leave DNA, permitting your lawyer to file a lawsuit which may allow you to hire a tutor and teach your child-reasoning minded son at home.
.....Name calling is what child-reasoning minded human beings do to each other in the absence of adult supervision.
.....Did your school participate in the October 2012 national anti-bullying program ?
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According to the C.D.C. 4,400 of our children take their own lives every year, because these are chronically bullied by their classmates.
I find this statistic absolutely tragic!
Most people that I speak with, state that a child that takes his/her own
life does not warrant our concern; since these have control over their
own fate.
I fail to understand such mentality, a child whether is murdered or is
driven to take his/her life is a terrible tragedy.
I think that we must address the issue of the gun culture in this country. Adam Lanza's mother, according to reports, owned several handguns and a semiautomatic and took her son to a gun range to target shoot. Why does a suburban mom need all those guns? Why in hell was she teaching him how to shoot? Did she think this would be some sort of "therapy" for the troubled boy? I know she wound up dead, and some will say it is heartless to lay any blame at her feet, that she has paid for her misguided ways, but so did 26 other people, mostly littlle children. We call "disturbed," but let's call this budding young marksman/sportsman what he really bedcame, a "murderer." The worst part is his own mother put the guns in his hands, communicated to him that guns were fun. Lethal wapons are not toys; no firing range should allow kids to come with their parents and play like they are playing a video game or Wii at home. Usually we think it's the fathers and grandfathers and uncles giving the kids access, but to find it was the mom? I am a mom and I would NEVER ever put a gun in either of my children's hands or allow them to go shooting with anyone. And they are both emotionally, socially and intellectually well adjusted. Hers wasn't and she knew it.
We have most times 3 + police reporting to small crimes. We can afford to have one officer at each school. In Israel their public area's all have armed guards.
Improving the student-teacher ratio in all K-12 schools would not only vastly improve the quality of education in the United States, but would put more trained adults in classrooms, hallways, lunchrooms, playgrounds, loading zones, field trips, and after school programs, allowing them to guide students through academic challenges, social conflicts, and emotional difficulties and thereby diffuse bullying, improve skill sets, boost self-esteem, and offer personalized support to "normal," special needs, and at-risk kids. Simple action; exponential results.
EXACTLY its a mental health issue.. we need to REOPEN the State mental Hospitals and reverse the rules to allow anyone who may be a harm to be committed for at least a 5 day commitment. For juvenals it should be an easy 30 day commitment. Back in the 60's and 70's it was easy. I know i was committed a few times and instead of lentghy processes i was put in and evaluated. I also had to leave being OFF MEDS unlike today where BIG PHARMA pushed drugs / meds on people and kicks them out of the hospitals. Insuances don't like paying for anything let alone mental health care. The states need to reopen their large state hospitals and also put in all drug users from prisons. That will take money from the private prison industry and put it back in state hospitals. Then they will not be realesed until they are off drugs / meds.. see my petition here https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/reopen-all-closed-state-mental... ALSO we need to change the standards where a person doesn't have to try to commit suicide to get committed. Newtown CT had a state hospital but they closed it in 1995. Its time to deal with mental health on a grand scale again. There needs to be adolecent wards and adult wards and geriatric wards etc etc so that state hospitals become small cities caring for all aspects of society.. We don't need to put them in jails where they are abused and private contractors make big bucks as we TAXPAYERS SUPPORT THOSE PRIVATE PRISONS.. Have some compassion for our mentall ill and people going thru issues.. I went thru that system and it saved my life.. please call your congress person and mental health people to demand these changes / reversal from todays Big Pharma drug pushers and private prisions.. PS: Adam would have been easily committed and taken care of by people who care and would have found a new life and possibly a group home one day..
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.....Some places of employment now provide some protection - like forts of necessity - from those who mis-use, metallic, portable, gas-propelled or gunpowder-propelled, ballistic machine tools.
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..... Those who can afford the cost will need to design education fort buildings.
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.....There will be no affordable protection from those who choose to explode a street-parked van; nor from those who choose to steal and crash an airplane.
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Come on Diane ! No One mentions of the real problem - MAYBE you will - but I'm doubting it.
Teach "Thou shall not kill !!!" By drones (thousands? more brown skinned babies) killed in the past year in an effort to eliminate our 'enemies'. If we don't like A Muslim aggitator, well then , 'KILL' him. If I'm mentally unstable, and don't like ...... ? Kill them. Hypocrisy reigns supreme. And I'm an Obama supporter!
My last child graduated 6 years ago from high school in Sandy Utah. We are a community similar to Newtown. After September 11, our schools implemented changes to protect our children. After school started each day, all doors, except the front door were automatically locked from entering from the outside. We could exit from the inside. Also, we had a police officer in every school. The kids called him Officer Bob. He learned most of their names. He was a great guy. Since, its expensive to have a police officer in every school, he traveled between schools (I'm not sure how many schools he covered). Officer Bob also "graduated" with the kids from elementary, to middle school, to high school. Therefore, he continued to know the kids and their families throughout their education. We'll run across Officer Bob while shopping, or at the park, and the kids still visit with him. This was a great addition to their community education.
This is so frustrating. The protocols at Sandy Hook are similar to those at many other schools. They failed. If the shooter had not been able to break through a reception window and open the front doors he could maybe have been slowed down enough for the police to arrive and save lives. Bullet proof or laminated glass is an obvious solution for securing the entry ways to our schools.
It has been reported that a locked door was enough to deter him inside the school. He went away after shouting to open the door. The teacher and students behind that door survived. So I don't want to hear that more physical security of the doors and entryways of schools is not a huge part of the answer. This is a very obvious, relatively low cost solution. Simply secure entry ways into schools and make sure those in charge of letting people in follow strict protocol.
The shooter at VA Tech and this one DID have access to mental health services and DID get attention in their schools from teachers and mental health professionals. It did not matter! STOP telling parents we are crazy for wanting the simple amount of security many office buildings in this country receive. Not to mention politicians in state and federal buildings who take every single precaution possible to prevent attacks on themselves.
We cannot secure all public places at all times, obviously. But it is well within our power to secure school buildings better.
Broader questions of gun control and mental health of course need to be addressed, but can't we please start with the most obvious and practical things first to protect innocent children???? We could do these things starting today.
I agree with you Nancy. Small changes in school protocol, along with the installation of reinforced doors, ballistic glass on at least first floor windows, security systems that would automatically sound internal alarms and contact police and administration, and locks on every class room door could go a long way in deterring these types of crimes.
Clearly some of these measures are more expensive than others. I think it could be a reasonable discussion for parents and administrators to have. I'd like to see our school board discuss funding a new security initiative and see where that could fit into the overall budget. I think that parents and administrators could reach an understanding about and what programs would need to be cut in order to improve school safety.