Mass Shootings And Their Effect On The American Psyche
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2012-12-17/mass-shootings-and-their-effect-american-psyche
Reaction to Friday’s school shooting in Newtown, Conn., has been loud and swift. New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg called on President Barack Obama to make gun control his No. 1 agenda. The dean of Washington’s National Cathedral said, “enough is enough ... the massacre of these 28 people in Connecticut is ... the last straw." A sense of helplessness and frustration is palpable across the nation. While many are calling for more controls on guns and ammunition, others say we must focus on creating a more accessible mental health system. They worry we aren’t doing enough to de-stigmatize treatment. Diane and her guests discuss the effects of mass shootings on the American psyche.
Guests
Ladd Everitt
director of communications at the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence.
Daniel Webster
co-director of the Center for Gun Policy and Research at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health.
Dr. Alan Lipman
director of the Center for the Study of Violence and professor at the George Washington University Medical Center.
Dr. Jana Martin
clinical psychologist with 30 years of practice with children and families. Dr. Martin also leads public education efforts with the American Psychological Association.
Comments
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Dianna, I listen to NPR because it provides information on subject areas not provided on other new stations. I listened to part of you show Dec 17, 2012 and was disappointed. The broadcast simply played on peoples emotions with what appear to be the objective of removing rights from citizens. There were no individuals “experts” included in the discussion to provide facts on the life saving incidences and the bigger picture results that come from the freedom to own and bear arms. Our country has benefited from this right far more than other countries in the world. You only have to listen to other stories NPR broadcasts about deprived countries where strife is a daily part of living.
HonestAbe wrote:
"It is ironic that there is so much discussion about young people playing violent games and watching violent TV. Those who grew up in the 40s, 50s, 60s all were exposed to toy guns and TV westerns and various wartime dramas.......many kids emulated the exploits of their fathers and grandfathers during WWII and Korea and Vietnam. Perhaps acting out as kids may have defused some of the violent tendencies.
More modern kids dont interact with other kids regarding games of "war" or weterns......they dont learn acceptable social restrictions on violence in any way......they sit in darkened rooms ALONE and get forced violent fantasies."
Alone getting forced violent fantasies?! I've never known a parent that held a kid down and forced "violent fantasies" on him/her. Perhaps you do. Perhaps you have?
As for the interaction thing ... I suppose you've never heard of XBOX Live. Oops - another brillian HA theory shot to ....
This is a parenting issue. Nothing more. Mrs. Lanza failed at that and it cost 28 lives. One might start by asking, why Adam Lanza had access to the weapons in her home? When will people learn that, sadly, bad s- happens. It always has, and it always will, whether there are guns in the hands of the public or not.
By Tim Wise
Race, Class, Violence and Denial: Mass Murder and the Pathologies of Privilege
Posted on December 17, 2012
The senselessness alone would have been sufficient.
So too the sheer horror.
The devastated families, the tapestry of their lives ripped apart, would have been more than enough to make the events at Sandy Hook Elementary almost too weighty to bear.
Much as they were more than a decade before at Columbine, or in any number of other mass or spree shootings — over five dozen by one count, more than 150 by another — that have played out over the past few decades.*
There is nothing, one would hope (and even suspect) that could make the present moment any worse.
And yet sadly, there is, and it is something that one hears almost every time one of these tragedies transpires. Over and again, no matter how frequently they happen, and no matter how often the specifics of the latest event eerily mirror the last one and the one before that — the high capacity weaponry, the apparent mental and emotional instability of the shooter, and the relatively bucolic surroundings of the locale where the deed is done — it is said again and again with no sense of irony or misgiving.
And it is maddening.
“This wasn’t supposed to happen here.”
Or perhaps, “No one could have imagined something like this happening in our community.”
Or even worse, “This is a nice, safe place,” which of course was the same thing said about Springfield, Oregon, Pearl, Mississippi, Littleton and Aurora, Colorado, Moses Lake, Washington, Jonesboro, Arkansas, Santee, California, Edinboro, Pennsylvania, Paduchah, Kentucky, and pretty much every one of the dozens of places where the things that never happen appear to happen regularly enough to constitute something well North of never; indeed quite a bit up from rare.
http://www.timwise.org/2012/12/race-class-violence-and-denial-mass-murde...
Newtown is a tragedy.
That being said, the talk of spending thousands of manhours and millions of dollars "investigating" this tragedy is a ridiculous waste of manpower and resources. What is going to be discovered by this extensive investigation of the "evidence" and hundreds of interviews?" Is it going to stop future incidents of this kind? Since none of the past investigations have, there's no reason to think this will either.
Closing the school for months, interviewing virtually everyone who ever came in cntact with Mr. Lanza, visited every shooting range in Connecticut...all this seems to be turning the tragedy into a giant boondoggle for the benefit of the Connecticut State Police as well as the FBI and ATF.
Where's the payoff in terms of the public good in this tremendous expenditure of time and money?
Out of all the fluff and mis-information spouted on this radio show this morning, Dr. Alan Lipman gets the prize. His statement about how the NRA promotes insurrection and shoot any politician you don't agree with using the 2nd amendment as an excuse is for lack of a better word, funny (almost).
There are over 10 million guns in the hands of american citizens. If this was true, where are all the dead politicians?
Oh, by the way, I loaded one of my pistols and laid it on a table in front of me.
I tried to make it mad by swearing and yelling at it. Try as I might, it just would not shoot me. It just sat there.
This is just another event that government is going to use to promote its agenda of disarming everyone except the criminals.
Jumpy, (A concerned Army Veteran)
Thanks to you Diane, your production team and to your guests for this very thoughtful, informed and informative conversation. I am a psychologist and a mother of an adult with Aspergers. In my practice I work with individuals and families impacted by Aspergers. Thanks to you all for separating out the powerful issues that the Newtown shooting has made us think about. We need civil and informed conversations as we move forward in the weeks and months to come. The Newtown shootings tragically remind us that we need better access and utilization of mental health services. They also remind us that we need more thoughtful conversations about access to firearms and thinking. Judgment and reasoning constitute necessary thinking skills for safe firearm use but these abilities can be impaired whether temporarily by substances such as alcohol or more long-term by neurological disorders/differences. Automatic weapons leave no time for safety when a shooter's judgment is impaired. As we discuss gun control in the coming weeks, I hope to hear conversations about modern firearms, thinking and safety.
We have mentally unstable people on the street with guns because human rights activists said it was unlawful to keep them locked up. Any psych will tell you that by law they can't keep someone against their own will, unless they demonstrate, (in the presence of 2 evaluators) that they will do harm #1 to themselves or #2 to others if released. Social services has a revolving door when it comes to those who need counciling and care. There is no place left for them to be housed and after 3 weeks in a shelter the funding is gone so "caregivers" turn them back out on the street or worse yet... into the same sad conditions that caused or exacerbated the psychosis or illness. Parents and spouses of effected people throw their hands up in the air in desperation after they finally wear out themselves, their family, their finances and sadly, sometimes, their marriage. The weapons used by these individuals to carry out their destructon are as varied as the individuals themselves. You can use guns as a political hockey puck, thinking you are smart, or that it is a partisan issue, but they are just a symptom of the problem. Controlling them is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to a viable solution. Responsibility and care for our own family members and friends and neighbors is a better option in my humble opinion. May God bless those who are hurting and may we all be more civil in our conversations...please.
I am discouraged that this terrible event (and everyone like it in the past) is being called a "school shooting" rather than a "massacre or murder." Where is this use of language coming from, and what impact do you all think it has on how we view or come up with a solution? To put it in perspective video games (which I will not name) call themselves 'first-person shooters' which are actually potential training grounds for learning desensitization and methods of killing. I think we need to call it what it is..."a murder and massacre" NOT a "shooting."
MI Engineer visualizes driving a car into a crowd "killing hundreds of people" as a viable alternative to gun violence; something to do if the authorities take your firearms. He likens a gun-free community to the Warsaw Ghetto. His rhetoric is packed with the kind of repressed and implied threats and aggression which make me view him as a bully. He is the enraged, not I. My suggestion was that he not take the side of armed fascists if he feared the Warsaw Ghetto.
Actually, China leads the world in mass murders at schools, or attempted mass murders. You just don't see it played out across the headlines because firstly, it's not the US and secondly, because they don't use firearms.
I tuned intoday expecting an intelligent discussion about a tragedy. Instead Diane featured a very biased and partisan presentation. No mention of the role of violent media, nonintact families, and the wholesale use of psychotropic drugs in young male students.
A lost opportunity.
jrfvsgo331 Maybe they denote it a "school shooting" in hopes we can learn something from it. Talk about desensitization: Most American employments are predatory behavior in service to an employer. It is our desensitized population that is more successful at work. You could deepen your understanding by exploring Hannah Ahrendt's "Eichmann in Jerusalem" (banal evil). Obama himself is a sentimental and hypocritical example of banal evil as part of careerism. He cries tears in the rain.
Some military vet on here wrote how he laid a loaded gun on a table and provoked it to shoot him. How horrible to visualize such suicidal delusion. Maybe he and his gun are such buddies that his resentment must soon turn elsewhere. Get help buddy.... get help soon. Throw that weapon away.
Pancake Rankin wrote:
"He likens a gun-free community to the Warsaw Ghetto. His rhetoric is packed with the kind of repressed and implied threats and aggression which make me view him as a bully. He is the enraged, not I. My suggestion was that he not take the side of armed fascists if he feared the Warsaw Ghetto."
Pancake, instead of simply attacking MI Engineer and labeling what he wrote as "rhetoric, implied threats, and aggression", why don't you refute the premise?
Premise, A gunless society is like the Warsaw Ghetto.
Now, Pancake ... refute that with facts, not attacks.
jmorris-China has 4 or 5 times our population but far fewer mass killings.
Their economic stress rivaling our own may soon manifest in many behavioral tragedies, but the material crimes are bad enough. Once the world's leading producer of wheat they have now lost 25% of yield to development, thinning soils, climate instability and water shortage. Great Lakes water is already being shipped there for chip manufacture. So maybe it is a blessing they have strong gun control. Now if we could only get our Oligarchs and their State Capitalists off their backs... but we appear to be in the same fix when the gun lobby dictates national policy here. Every gun pusher claiming that discussion of public safety somehow curtails their rights amounts to a bully wound up by gun manufacturing propaganda. Why do they want to unload on DRShow? Well it's not to enrich discourse. Veiled gun threats are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Pancake Rankin wrote:
"MI Engineer; You're part of the problem, so go away.
If you're afraid of NAZIS don't fraternize with them."
First rule of debate-losing:The Hitler/Naz/Fascist Comparison. All are the equivalent to laying down your King on the chessboard , game over immediately.
ecgberht- One concedes by playing the Hitler card only when Holocaust deniers make the rules. And after all it was the Engineer who dealt the Warsaw Ghetto face up. Does ecgberht deny 13 million camp deaths: Jews, Roma, Leftists, Unionists, the disabled and elderly, resistance and surplus Polish. Real history is always legitimate in politics. Or is ecgberht the anticipated victor already rewriting the facts? Maybe. If the profile fits, wear it. Are you Golden Dawn or Golden Corral?
Hi Diane, This is a multi-tier issue:
1)I think that it may be determined that Adam Lanz was in the midst of a psychotic meltdown and had Schizophrenia. What once was thought to be Aspergers was a misdiagnosis. In the early 60s the closing of mental institutions occurred because of many inhumane practices and treatments. Today, there are psychiatric wards in regular hospitals. However, these facilities are not set up to provide long-term care. Families bare most of the burden in caring for mentally ill children.
2) "Boy culture" is rampant with violent video games and movies. In 2011, the Supreme Court upheld that these video games makers could continue to sell these violent games to teens under the First Amendment.
3) Mentally ill individuals with psychosis cannot distinguish between fantasy and reality...mix their mind up with violent games and films and you have a VERY DANGEROUS person.
4) A fourth component is needed to create a tragedy: access to fire arms.
Diane,
I'm curious why you steered away from acknowledging the very real point the second to last caller brought up?
He (the kindergarten teacher of 30 years) mentioned the war/s. I'd been waiting thru the whole show, hoping someone would do so. He was the only one, and attention was quickly shifted back to the "mental health" of people who do these things, after his call. Why? Isn't the fact that this country has spent many years in war . . . killing, with guns . . . relevant to the subject of mass shootings? Doesn't that take it's toll on the American Psyche?
Have you heard the suicide rate for soldiers returning from war? No, the shooter was not a soldier returning from war but that is the culture children are being raised in: it's okay to solve problems by killing other people via war and it's okay to shoot people in violent video games.
The caller respectfully mentioned the fact that many children and families have been killed by U.S. drones, and that we feel / acknowledge / process THIS (CT) loss most profoundly, because it's close to home.
You responded by asking how he felt, hearing President Obama read the names of those who died.
Surely, I am not the only one who feels a sense of cognitive dissonance when: on the one hand, there is a huge emphasis on the loss of these lives in CT and how to talk with our children about this--to tell 'em they are safe at home and school; and, on the other hand, there has never been such public attention to "processing" or grieving the lives of many children and families who've been killed by U.S. hands.
Are those lives lost less precious, simply because they are far away and we do not know their names? Do parents and teacher in those countries tell the children: don't worry, school and home are safe? Do they have that luxury?
When we place so much emphasis on the suffering of people in our own country, and minimize empathy and care for those who are far away, we are teaching our children hypocrisy. How can we question the mental health of these shooters, without questioning the mental health of our country? How can we tell parents to teach children how to process their emotions, and solve things non-violently, when our country is at war . . . solving things violently?
I feel a sense of anger at the injustice; confusion over the hypocrisy of this country's response. We can't learn anything from only looking outside ourselves, for someone (else) to blame.
I mean no disrespect to the families who've lost loved ones in the shooting. I, too, feel a deep sense of grief and shock. I, too, am in mourning for these children and teachers. I, too, have been having difficult conversations, with my own two children (ages 10 & 12), about this event. Tomorrow, when I return to school, I will likely be called to answer questions from any of the 130+ students I work with, each week.
It is a big BIG issue, a speck in an interconnected web of disfunction we are living in. This shooting brought many untended strands to the greater public attention. My hope is that, at least, something profoundly good will come of this tragedy, as people move (are moved) to create healthy change in our country.
All good points... soon you will need a gun to vote... The US exports 66.3 billion dollars in arms every year that’s about 2/3 of all arms sales in the world yearly according to the New York Post (100 million in Small Arms). I believe that we (America) export to countries in the defense of freedom as this is how we won ours. So is this behavior not also engrained into the American culture? How can we expect people to act differently if we as Americans have always been taught that guns=freedom?
we seem to be seeing that on TV alot lately in Libya, AF, Iraq, Syria.. guns=freedom.. Bet there are a bunch of guys in Iraq that got a brand new assault rifle from the US government that didnt get a background check and ARE nuts.
"ecgberht wrote:
Pancake Rankin wrote:
...
Pancake, instead of simply attacking MI Engineer and labeling what he wrote as "rhetoric, implied threats, and aggression", why don't you refute the premise?
Premise, A gunless society is like the Warsaw Ghetto.
Now, Pancake ... refute that with facts, not attacks.
December 17, 2012 - 3:15 pm"
As usual, eggie is far, far out Right Field.
The Jews were not gunless, but were doomed when the Nazis opened their heavy artillery, armor and air forces.
Wake up, you empty-headed blabbermouth. Do you know anything about the Warsaw Uprising? Do you know anything about anything?? Have you no shame??
Incidentally, I'm aggregating all your threats that imply what you Jackasses are going to do if Obama gets too aggressive, then I'm going to follow that with my piece on what happened when the Jarheads conducted a simulated arms sweep in Urbanna, VA and what you George W. Bush Patriot wannnabes did about it.
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
THX1138, many states do require photo i.d. to vote. Weaponry can be bought on the internet and through straw men too easily and the NRA fights any attempts to strengthen the laws, close loopholes, or require longer waiting periods allowing vetting of the would-be buyer.
There is absolutely no reason for private citizens to own semi or automatic weapons or clips that allow for multiple shots. We need federal laws that keep weapons from being converted to semi and automatic with the addition of parts.
I hope you reflect on what you wrote and see the blame and divisiveness in your own words. We need to figure out solutions together rather than belittle those of differing opinions.
The email from the listener who spoke of "circling the wagons" was positively chilling but he's a perfect example of the fringe NRA supporters who, in addition to the Newtown horror, will finally propel the rest of us to action.
I refuse to live in a country in which we'd rather train teachers for combat than ban assault weapons and pro-actively care for our mentally ill.
I found today's show shameful. The guests were extremely unbalanced and just as misinformed. Diane's personal feelings on the subject of gun control were painfully obvious and as with her guests coming from an uneducated realm. They had no business broadcasting nationally the way that they did.
World Have Your Say on the BBC actually did a good job. Take notes. This show is slipping in standards and quality.
when does this child acquire these rights, before or after birth?
Just heard that Hawaii Sen. Daniel Inouye has died.
I will never forget the images of that filthy little piece of perjurious, treasonous, Jar Head, Christian Pimp, Reagan Bush S_it, Ollie North lecturing the real War Hero in front of the whole Senate.
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
"Wake up, you empty-headed blabbermouth. "
Flagged as offensive.
By the way, of the two of us, I'm the one that VISITED the remains of the Warsaw ghetto in Poland.
In 2009, 784,507 legal induced abortions were reported to CDC from 48 reporting areas. The abortion rate for 2009 was 15.1 abortions per 1,000 women aged 15–44 years and the abortion ratio was 227 abortions per 1,000 live births.CDC’s Abortion Surveillance System FAQs
didn't see this in the news.
moop wrote: THX1138, many states do require photo i.d. to vote. Weaponry can be bought on the internet and through straw men too easily and the NRA fights any attempts to strengthen the laws, close loopholes, or require longer waiting periods allowing vetting of the would-be buyer.
Yes a few states require photo I.D. to vote, very few. SEVEN to be exact, is that "many"
It is a federal offense to sell firearms out of state for both private sellers and in business gun dealers unless it is a pre 1898 firearm (antique). No dealer in their right mind would consider doing this. All firearm in state sales also must be face to face with the proper paper work for dealers. Post offices, UPS and fed ex require a signed copy of an FFL to ship firearms. I am sure this is something you saw on TV.
The failures in these cases have more to do with deficiences with our national mental health efforts than with guns. Efforts to restrict the rights and liberties of law-abiding Americans are are not only insulting, but dangerous to the future of our republic.