Mass Shootings And Their Effect On The American Psyche
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2012-12-17/mass-shootings-and-their-effect-american-psyche
Reaction to Friday’s school shooting in Newtown, Conn., has been loud and swift. New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg called on President Barack Obama to make gun control his No. 1 agenda. The dean of Washington’s National Cathedral said, “enough is enough ... the massacre of these 28 people in Connecticut is ... the last straw." A sense of helplessness and frustration is palpable across the nation. While many are calling for more controls on guns and ammunition, others say we must focus on creating a more accessible mental health system. They worry we aren’t doing enough to de-stigmatize treatment. Diane and her guests discuss the effects of mass shootings on the American psyche.
Guests
Ladd Everitt
director of communications at the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence.
Daniel Webster
co-director of the Center for Gun Policy and Research at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health.
Dr. Alan Lipman
director of the Center for the Study of Violence and professor at the George Washington University Medical Center.
Dr. Jana Martin
clinical psychologist with 30 years of practice with children and families. Dr. Martin also leads public education efforts with the American Psychological Association.
Comments
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Why are we paying so much attention to this story?
The murder of 28 people in Connecticut is a tragedy. But the violence committed by Mexican drug cartels is also a tragedy, and it is perhaps hundreds of more times more likely to hurt Americans, through either the drugs or violence that result from their business.
Last week, a major story broke about how an international bank (HBSC) had been caught laundering money for the cartels, and how they were only punished with a fine for their criminal behavior. While the fine was less than 10% of their annual profits, and it wasn't even reported whether the fine covered the amount of money the bank made by laundering money for the cartels, Iran, Burma, and other criminal accounts, Americans didn't pay nearly as much attention to that story as they are to the Connecticut shooting.
Why is that? Is it because the idea of a shooter plays more directly on our fears? Is it because this story gives us more opportunity to fight with our neighbors over gun laws? Or is it because the media gives more airtime to lone gunmen stories?
I suspect that it has a lot to do with the media coverege, and that the media responds to these lone shooter tragedies because they are cheaper and easier to research than banking malfeasance. Plus, lone shooters don't represent moneyed iterests that could harm the media's ad revenues. But what price do we pay when we focus our national outrage on rare tragedies, rather than ongoing scandals that could lead to drug addictions, human rights abuses, or a nuclear armed Iran?
I have no doubt the information read by Ms. Rehm was from one who believes in chaotic and random gun ownership (not a conspiracy theory from someone on the opposite end of the spectrum). Those who follow the gun safety discussions know that some members of the NRA troll such media outlets including FB. I also want to add that I know some members of the NRA who are logical gun owners- would like there to be more.
There are multiple deadly weapons in our country but by far the most rapid and widespread method of killing and harming other people is the gun, particularly automatic and semi automatic weapons paired with our deficit of gun law.
I believe we need a three prong approch to the national dialogue: Addressing mental health/illness issues, promoting "Trauma Informed Communities" that focus on a holistic approach to dealing with trauma issues (based on the understanding that "it takes a village to raise a child," and realistic gun management laws (why not require gun owners who have guns for recreational purposes to be members of gun clubs where the weapons must be kept under lock and key?).
Gun ownership in this country is so entrenched that we need to approach the issues more broadly. Having said that, I recently read an editorial that reminded the reader that cars are a mode of transportation, knives are cutting tools. When people are killed by those instruments it's because they are being mis-used. Guns, on the other hand, have no other purpose but to kill.
MERCER, Pa. — Authorities say a 7-year-old boy was shot to death when a gun accidentally went off as his father was getting into his truck outside a western Pennsylvania gun store.
The boy was shot Saturday morning at Twigs Reloading Den in East Lackawannock Township, 60 miles north of Pittsburgh. Store owner Leonard Mohney says it happened in the parking lot.
The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review reports that the boy was shot when his father’s handgun went off as the man got into the truck while holding the gun.
Police say 44-year-old Joseph V. Loughrey told them he had emptied the magazine but didn’t realize a bullet was still in the chamber. Seven-year-old Craig Allen Loughrey was shot in the chest and died at the scene.
State police are investigating the shooting as an accident.
Pancake, you seem to be raging right now, so I'll excuse your tone.
I don't know if you're able right now, but I'm asking you to bring the rhetoric down a notch so we can have a rational discussion about why young people, generally young men, are being driven to these acts of martydom.
"Part of the problem..." Well, I think we need to FRAME the problem in order to fix it, and that hasn't been done sufficiently in this discussion. That's what I'm trying to bring attention to!
Why do we (society) think it's so great, and applaud when someone falls on a grenade, or dies on a cross, or flies a plane into the world trade center?
Why did this kid think he was performing a great act of martyrdom when he did what he did? This is the sickness and confusion that we need to learn to identify and eliminate.
Tell me, if you can, how will we prohibit sick individuals from accessing any of the hundreds of means of mass killing that are available, if this person is committed?
Let me remind you, that access to firearms and ammunition is difficult and very EXPENSIVE. Many other means are cheaper and more available.
I do "fraternize" with lots of types of people, but no Nazis, neo or otherwise. After all , I'm chatting with you! If you would kindly leave the Nazi's out of the conversation, we can move on more rationally. It's a thing, from the past, it's dead. I neither fear nor respect them.
Interesting idea, stanmathews!
I am listening to your current program and am offended by your guests. I am not among those who overspend and fail to save. My wife and I are in our early 50s. My wife contributes (at least 10%) to her companys 401K and takes advantage of the company match. I am in the investment and gift-planning field and am well-informed about investments. I, along with my employer, contribute 14% to a defined Pension Plan, plus 5%-7% to TDA (tax deferred annuities), plus after-tax savings, plus investment in my own stock account. We have a good home in a good location that will be fully paid off by the time we retire. Yet, we still feel like we are treading water at best. Why? ...because of government mismanagement, wall-street corruption and greed. At the most critical time for us -- the last 12 yrs; throughout our 40s and early 50s -- the market has been stagnant at best.
I am not a fan of the show per se. I listen occasionally, enjoy some, have to turn some off because of the obviously biased attitude.
This is sinking to a new low. Having on individuals from such rabid anti-gun, hoplophobic organizations without an opposing viewpoint, not challenging bombastic statements and outright lies. All she did was provide a soapbox.
I wish the psychologist had got to talk more. She made sense.
I'm afraid I won't be tuning in for some time. But that's OK because I'll enjoy an hour of classical music instead.
The events that took place in Newtown, CT were a tragedy; of that there is no doubt. I am not, however, convinced that the political process of the U.S. should focus on mental health or gun control while there are even more important issues facing civilization.
Humans are destroying the environmental systems upon which we rely. The historical record is littered with civilizations that collapsed, in which environmental problems played an important role in their collapse (i.e. the Assyrian empire, the Khmer civilization, the Anasazi culture).
As global industrial civilization is apparently unwilling to adequately address the environmental problems it has created, and which are themselves global in nature, I expect the human population of Earth will fall by several billion people within this century (and, if we use our worst nuclear and biological weapons, we will likely drive ourselves extinct)... a far greater tragedy than the mass shooting at Newtown.
Enrico Fermi once asked "Where is everybody?" in reference to the fact that we don't have any evidence for any non-human civilizations in the universe. Perhaps the answer is that intelligence, as we understand it, is not conducive to the long-term survival of the species that develops it. Our intelligence deals relatively well with immediate and obvious problems but not as well with long-term issues (known in economics as "discounting the future").
Over and over this new female screener disproportionately allows men callers through. Know I could spend a bunch of time going through recent shows and archives to prove my point but will just take the last two shows I have listened to. Friday round up international hour..three men one woman (after i mentioned on line the bias) Today during the gun program three men callers through no women, This gender bias goes on on many national call in programs but one would think on the Rehm show less. But not so, Now the screener will allow more women through on the lady issues but not on international foreign policy or like today gun control. You know those are guy things right screener. Your bosses should listen more closely. this genderbias is going on
Diane thank you for bringing tough topics to the forefront making them additionally difficult for society to avoid.
Last Friday as I stood in front of my television in heartbreak and tears watching the news of the murderers one of our Pennsylvania legislators were interviewed by a local station. The reporter asked what could be done about the guns, to my complete disbelief his response was - very little could be done we cant take the guns away. It's like alcohol we tried during the prohibition and it wasn't successful.
How can we as a society move forward when we have a population of politicians such as this man holding this belief. My daughter Morgan was murdered by a drunk driver in 2007, she and her friend Crystal were killed instantly while on their way home from Christmas shopping- both 21 with bright futures. Five years since their death, I'm still hearing nothing can be done. Why- because the sale of alcohol provides so very much income for the state of Pennsylvania. I ask--- How much money is one's child's life worth?
When a politician speaks they represent and are regarded, my message to them is to slip off your comfortable fine leather shoes and place your feet in the shoes of the parents currently speaking their final good byes to their precious babies then examine your positions and move forward with the compassion and commitment that the wonderful people who make up America deserve.
Susan in Elizabethtown
Ian Herring wrote: "Why are we paying so much attention to this story? (snip) I suspect that it has a lot to do with the media coverage,…?"
Good question. David Brooks on NPR last Friday suggested the media should not even mention the names of these "rampage shooters". Good for him. Might save a lot of lives. Now one more of these disturbed young men has his name carved into history, and will be remembered long after the names of the victims are lost. Great job news media.
Arm teachers? Like we dont already have an environment like Shootout at the OK Corral. Imagine the lawsuits that would evolve from an accidental injury or death caused by a teachers gun.
40% of guns are purchased WITHOUT any background check......the number of gun show purchases is NOT well controlled.
Want real 2nd Amendment rights? OK......turn in ALL existing weapons in exchange for flintlock muskets circa 1789......and those muskets must be individually and collectively monitored and controlled by each legal state militia......not in individual control. Note: no add on mechanisms for those muskets either......no Gatling guns or large feeder devices.
Common sense says that not everyone should be allowed access to handguns. Or any kind of gun for that matter. Having once owned a handgun, I can say for certain that the process of getting a driver's license was far more strict.
The problem seems to be that common sense has become a "National Deficit" now.
Thanks you, Diane for doing this show. Too often after these tragedies, we focus solely on the inappropriate access to guns. Yes, this is a huge problem (I am not a gun owner or proponent), but almost all of these murderers are/have been mentally ill. I could not agree with more with you guests. Acceptance and education early in life will help, along with better help for parents, in addition to better gun laws.
In the discussions about how to help the young children cope with this horrific experience, I would like to hear some discussion about what - for this age child (elementary school) - is the most upsetting, and that is the emotional state of their parents and the other adults around them. The fear, grief, and other extreme emotions of the adults in the children's lives has the potential to create as great, if not greater, emotional problems for them.
A member of Congress appeared on George Stephanopoulis' show on Sunday, bragging that he had weapons and a concealed carry permit. I would bet more than a nickel he was NOT allowed to have that weapon on the news program.
Maybe the public should demand to know what such concealed carriers are really scared of.
It is ironic that the fear mongers who insist on carrying guns end up as the ones generating the most fear.
Where does weapon ownership really end and the rights of non owners begin?
We have a right to live without being menaced by gun toting pinheads.
GUNS do kill people....the weapon choice does affect the number and amount of damage. How many people were hurt by longbows or javelins this year? If a handheld neutron bomb became available, would all the gun nitwits insist on having one? Should we be glad that cowardly murderers leave their grenade launchers and RPGs at home?
As we were driving to church yesterday we were listening to NPR. Someone said that the killer's mother had TAKEN HIM TO A FIRE RANGE!!! WHY would she want her son, who had mental problems, to learn to shoot a weapon designed to kill?????
Please ask your guests - I don't understand how there is obviously mental illness in other parts of the world, but there are not these same types of mass murders. It all seems to point to the gun culture of America.
It is ironic that there is so much discussion about young people playing violent games and watching violent TV. Those who grew up in the 40s, 50s, 60s all were exposed to toy guns and TV westerns and various wartime dramas.......many kids emulated the exploits of their fathers and grandfathers during WWII and Korea and Vietnam. Perhaps acting out as kids may have defused some of the violent tendencies.
More modern kids dont interact with other kids regarding games of "war" or weterns......they dont learn acceptable social restrictions on violence in any way......they sit in darkened rooms ALONE and get forced violent fantasies.
Why are US gun holders seemingly more bent on violence?
The Trolly Square shooting in Salt Lake City has seen little recognition. The shooter was stopped by and armed off duty officer. Many people here in Utah have concealed carry permits for protecting themselves and other citizens. Teachers here also have the opportunity to be armed in the classroom. That isn't a bad thing.
I propose that the only way to curtail "violence" is to follow the money,
that is identify those who profit from it and gradually constrain their ability to do so. This must include not only arms makers but those whose products and actions promote a culture and society of violence.
In the field of psychology, it is generally accepted that the subconscious mind does not distinguish between the real and the virtual, consequently the conscious mind is left to make these distinctions. If children or adults watch or engage in virtual violence day after day after day, they are in effect programming their subconscious minds with the paradigm of violence. If the conscious mind isn't strong, then this "programming" can ultimately dominate their actions, hence, every so often something like Newtown happens.
The problem is that we are force fed violence because it sells. Cut off the ability to profit from it and eventually it will subside.
I am Scottish. In 1996 my elementary school, Dunblane was attacked by a crazy mentally disturbed man, an ex Cub Scout master. He killed 16 young innocent kids and a school teacher. His weapons were legally obtained and licensed by the police. The response by the vast majority of the British public was to demand a ban on hand guns and strict restriction of rifles. Over the years legislation was enacted to ban all hand guns and limit rifles with magazines to 3 or 4 rounds. This satisfies deer hunters and farmers who still have access to arms under strict regulations. In the UK we too have a violent culture, violent movies and games, a history of war/aggression and yes mental health issues just as the USA. The reason we have about 39 deaths (murderers) a year with guns and the USA has 10,000 is because of limited access to guns. As a Brit living in America I am so frustrated that there is such support for the rights of people to have access to military grade, assault weapons, large clips and mags over the safety of the innocent children. If you insist on being armed for self defense and hunting...then fine...low caliber and low clip/mag non semi auto guns please! Put the rights and safety of the innocent above the rights of those who want to possess military grade arms. The difference between the individual Brit that is mentally disturbed, suicidal, murder inclined and the equivalent American...is access to these weapons.
@lublybacon
The boy's psychologist said to let him have guns, it would be a good outlet.
It is not responsible for your program to portray gun advocates as radicals and as racists.
Ma'am,
First off, the horrific crime in Newtown Connecticut was terrible and appalling. I abhor the thought of such terrible violence. Although violence comes in waves across the globe, it continues to bring sorrow.
I am a soldier with multiple combat tours to Iraq and Afghanistan, a gun owner and hunter from the West.
I feel less safe here in DC, than out West. The extreme violence in this area coupled with strict gun control laws is a strange dynamic. I left guns with my family out West, because of the strict gun control laws.
Since arriving in DC there have been shootings not far from our home. DC anti-gun laws are more restrictive than Virginia, but DC and Maryland have the most violent crime.
Displeased with the one sided discussion by your panel, in particular the emotional tirade by Ladd Everett, who is an extreme anti-gun advocate and obvious opponent of the 2nd Ammendment.
There needs to be an intelligent discussion on these issues, but his comments were too one sided.
Your show could have been more effective if you had included the President of the NRA, or someone like that to round out the discussion.
Picking those who support just one view makes your discussions small.
The comments by Dr. Lipman were poignant describing the issues dealing with mentally unstable individuals and how we could possibly shore mental health care. Aligning those changes up with some type of controls to try to prevent unstable individuals from using deadly tools like firearms is the issue.
Suicide murders occur with frequency throughout the world, probably daily. It would seem that this antisocial behavior has great appeal for many. I'd like to see less news coverage of these events to at least try to eliminate the "fame" aspect. At least Lanza is dead; some end up in prison, famous and costing more than a first responder's salary to keep them there.
I would like to respond further to the mother, Alecia, who called in describing her very difficult situation. She and her husband are apparently divorced and they have a son with Asperger's Syndrome and likely a thought disorder (psychosis) who has threatened her and his siblings and is now living with his father. It appears the boy is not getting treatment because the father doesn't think it is needed. I'm a pediatric mental health professional and a specialist on neurodevelopmental delays like autism spectrum disorders (ASD). A few points...
- clearly not every child/adult with an ASD is a psychopath
- co-morbid mental health conditions do occur with an ASD, but psychosis is not that common
Your speakers have been brilliant by I want to add one more element to the formula of guns + mentally ill persons, and that is ISOLATION and REJECTION
kathleen wrote:
"Over and over this new female screener disproportionately allows men callers through. Know I could spend a bunch of time going through recent shows and archives to prove my point but will just take the last two shows I have listened to. Friday round up international hour..three men one woman (after i mentioned on line the bias) Today during the gun program three men callers through no women"
I agree with you on the whole, kathleen, but your statement about today's show is not accurate. The very first caller was a woman whose son has Aspergers.
HonestAbe wrote:
"40% of guns are purchased WITHOUT any background check......the number of gun show purchases is NOT well controlled."
Have a source for that, HA?
"Want real 2nd Amendment rights? OK......turn in ALL existing weapons in exchange for flintlock muskets circa 1789......"
Fine - as long as the military turns in its guns and goes back to using muskets as well. You have no clue about Amendment #2.