Richard Hasen: "The Voting Wars: From Florida 2000 to the Next Election Meltdown"
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2012-08-21/richard-hasen-voting-wars-florida-2000-next-election-meltdown
Since the 2000 election, the U.S has witnessed a partisan war over voting rules. Election lawsuits have more than doubled. Every day we hear about challenges to voter ID and early voting laws. Campaigns deploy “armies of lawyers” and social media provokes partisan dissent when elections are expected to be close. And that’s not to mention actual defects in the voting process. Even after major reforms over the past decade, our elections are still plagued with problems. Lists of eligible voters are inaccurate, procedures vary from county to county and election officials are often called partisan. Diane and author Richard Hasen discuss fixing the way we run our elections.
Guests
Richard Hasen
Chancellor's Professor of Law and Political Science, University of California, Irvine School of Law
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Read An Excerpt
Excerpted from "The Voting Wars: From Florida 2000 to the Next Election Meltdown" by Richard Hasen. Copyright 2012 by Richard Hasen. Reprinted here by permission of Yale University Press. All rights reserved.
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Where would America be if the Diebold machines were used, instead of the simple voting box, in the 1960’s when all citizens became empowered because of their new access to the power of the vote? Who thinks African-Americans would have been elected as representatives throughout the South if the infamous Diebold machines were in place in the 1960's?
Why not fully implement election monitoring via exit polls. The late Rod Serling's Twilight Zone re-emerges on Election Day. That is the only day of the year, and the United States is the only place on earth, where mathematical theory of sampling and scientific rigor of data gathering don't function. On other days and in other countries exit polls accurately call election results - Yes, the United States of America entered The Twilight Zone on Election Day. Even with President Obama's election, the final result was inconsistent with the average across the major pre-election polls (Zogbe, Gallup, CNN).
In contrast, Congress just passed legislation that sampling be used to monitor listeria and two other pathogens in our food supply. Sampling works for monitoring pathogens but not for monitoring accurate voting, and it doesn't work only in the U.S., and only on Election Day? Really? Every person who reasonably qualifies to vote should and the votes should be monitored for accuracy. Are these un-American values.
Topic: What Have the Exit Polls Shown?
In Freeman & Bleifuss, (2006), with the Forward by Congressman Conyers, the authors write:
Based on the exit polls, Kerry won three states that he would lose in the official count: Ohio (by 8.8 percentage points), Nevada (7.5 points), New Mexico (7.0) had a lead within the polling margin of error in three more: Florida (2.6 points), Iowa (2.3 points and Colorado (1.4 points); and was trailing within the margin of error in three others: Virginia (0.3 points), North Carolina (1.4 points and Missouri (1.4 points). The net result is an electoral victory for Kerry of 282-174, with 82 electoral votes too close to call. (p.135 from Was the 2004 presidential election stolen? Exit polls, election fraud, and the official count).
One can see the old USCOUNTVOTES.org website, and other newer websites, for their scientifically proven methods to monitor the votes.
Why not give the Academy of Sciences, GAO and/or American Statistical Association (ASA) the necessary precinct and exit polling data so that they can determine who wins AND by how much (These data have been hidden from the public because of the excuse that the data belong to the companies conducting the exit polls. The same logic would have the Government excluded from classified information because company contractors built a computer system, or Nevada not auditing the computer programs running the slot machines)
Every person who reasonably qualifies to vote should and the votes should be monitored for accuracy. Again, are these un-American values?
Dear Statman2:
I'm always impressed by people who think they can comment on a show before it airs.
Negatively impressed!
He was commenting on the topic, not the show.
Etaoin Shrdlu wrote: /// VanFromGreensboro wrote: "He was commenting on the topic, not the show"
Don't worry about what that conceited control freak thinks about anything. Your posts are clearly what the D.R. show had in mind by allowing early posting. If he doesn't like it he should just pack up and take all his condescending opinions and distortions with him and go.
The Presidential election is a national federal election. Can any of your guest explain why there has never been uniformity across every state? Do we have to accept that some people want to keep being able to mess with state election laws so they can manipulate the process.
Can your guest please discuss any serious efforts to create and enforce consistent and uniform voting laws in every state in our country?
Exit polls no longer match totals from electronic machines.
THE REAL VOTE FRAUD..
I am a responsible adult who has had 4 layoffs. Last layoff in 2009 I received no notice or severance. I went from 78,000/year to 0. I'm working and have been for over a year, but am barely past HALF my prelayoff salary.
I didn't have thousands and thousands in debt, along with medical bills. I was paying everything on time prior to my layoff. I made the debts in good faith, was not overextended, and had every intention of honoring the debt.
I didn't have ENOUGH unsecured debt for some of the consumer credit firms to help, and they don't handle medical bills. One told me they didn't have arrangements with my creditors so couldn't help me. When calling a credit card company, you must be able to make payments in SOME amount. However, when one is struggling to live (electricity, rent, food, car note, gas, insurance, etc...) and "robbing Peter to pay Paul" as my mom used to say, there is just nothing left. Wishing I had a different financial picture just was not effective! Wanting to pay my debts didn't work either. YES, I got the notices. YES, I opened my mail. YES, I contacted my creditors. YES, I even had a good amount of savings that I drew from for some time. But considering the uncertainty and instability of my financial future, i just couldn't in good conscience make payment arrangements that I knew I could not keep! I had no choice but to let those things go to collections. I am now trying to work through collection agencies to get everything paid but it is still a struggle. Also consider when you have JUST ENOUGH to live on and something happens (such as medical bills or car repairs), that means something ELSE won't get paid. Then you are behind on phone, electric, etc., and catching up is a horrible and vicious cycle unless you're fortunate enough to be infused with additional cash. Yeah, right.
Your guest in support of credit card companies needs to have a REAL hard time when he had NO alternatives. Walk a block in my moccasins...
The only acceptable voting system other than hand counted paper ballots is a system in which the voter marks a ballot, inserts it in a ballot box and which can be counted electronically or by hand.
The only system of which I am aware that meets these requirements is the optical scan ballot.
Receipts from computerized voting machines are useless.
As a software engineer, I do not trust computerized voting machines.
We know the problems with punched cards and hanging chads.
Voter confidence in the integrity of the voting process has eroded, especially since the 2000 presidential election, but voter confidence is critical to the continued existence of our democracy.
Once that is resolved, we still have the problem of partisan election authorities who manipulate the voting and registration system for their party's advantage.
We need non-partisan election administration and non-partisan redistricting commissions.
Look at what is going on Pennsylvania, where Republican officials have stated that the voter id law will assure a Republican victory in November and admitted in court that there had been no instances of in-person voter fraud - which the voter id law supposedly addressed.
Look at Ohio which tried to have longer early voting hours in Republican counties than in Democratic countied.
Look at Florida purging voter rolls to disenfranchise minorities who vote Democratic.
Cook County Illinois - 1960 presidential election.
Please discuss the particulars of that scandal.
I have to wonder what the effect would be if we had more than a 50% turn out at the polls.
Mr. Hasen referred to the Wisconsin vote where an elections clerk miraculously came up with 15,000 votes that threw the election to the Rethuglican candidate as "incompetence." One of the problem is that that particular election official has had similar incidents in the past. Once is incompetence, when it happens repeatedly you have to assume that state elections officials are encouraging this behavior.
People who lack the interest to go vote are less likely to have enough interest to do the study of candidates to make informed choices. Votes made on superficial emotions stirred by campaign rhetoric and, even worse, advertising are likely to reflect poor choices.
On voter identification, as best I recall I have been asked for some form of identification every time I voted, the voter registration card at very least.
Impersonating Eric Holder worked when someone from Breitbart TV almost did it! (Didn't proceed, that would have put him in jail)
Also, states are bending over backwards to get those without an ID to get one FREE! They'll even drive them to the places to do it!
Compare Florida 2000 with Cook County 1960.
Nixon chose to not pursue investigations because of the damage the scandal would do to the nation and the credibility of the election process.
The accuracy of Nixon's concerns was confirmed by Al Gore when he pursued the issue through court trials to the bitter end.
I just heard you talking about the Heritage Foundation claim that voter fraud is a big problem according to a 1984 report. Your guest had to get a copy from a library because Heritage refused to provide one.
Now, you invite the Heritage author on to your program to comment? You have had him on in the past? And, would invite him in the future? Why? We just heard it established that the Heritage author is a liar. Why do you allow proven liars to have a platform on your program? Why are you willing to tolerate liars? There comes a time when people who claim to be journalists, like yourself, have to draw a line. When someone lies to you, you need to expose it, and never have them back on, and make sure everyone know why. I'm sick of listening to right-wing liars continue to get a pass from people like you.
Rehm - Your liberal left leanings are obvious - try for some balance!
I appreciate Hasen's truthful presentation of the facts and Diane being on point.
It is no exaggeration that tens of thousands in Ohio 2004 were denied votes, thanks in part to the orchestrations of GOP's Kenneth Blackwell.
Heritage Foundation? I have argued that distortions have no place in a factual, intelligent discussion as expected from this show, even if there's often someone to call them out.
In questioning Hans von Spakovsky's source on voter fraud, Mr. Hasen said that it is a principle of scholarship that you make your sources available to others. That's absolutely correct. But von Spakovsky's employer, the Heritage Foundation, cloaks a highly partisan mission under a mask of pseudo scholarship. Mr. Spakovsky may have the academic-sounding title like Senior Fellow, but he is no more an academic than Karl Rove.
The former head of the Florida State RNC stated categorically that in meetings the RNC specifically was looking to suppress the African-American vote.
The Open Voting Solution tried with a combination optical scan ballot and paper back-up. At least then the software can be peer reviewed. LOL, Linux machines can be had for <$100 that would run the software. No takers.
Politics is a blood sport, and far too many in power or want to be in power justify their vision of the ends as justifying any means necessary to obtain it. Washington State is 100% mail-in voting. I don't know if that removes the partisanship in the counting, but at least it maximizes the opportunity. Too funny that some jurisdictions won't let their process be observed.
Ron
The Open Voting Solution tried with a combination optical scan ballot and paper back-up. At least then the software can be peer reviewed. LOL, Linux machines can be had for <$100 that would run the software. No takers.
Politics is a blood sport, and far too many in power or want to be in power justify their vision of the ends as justifying any means necessary to obtain it. Washington State is 100% mail-in voting. I don't know if that removes the partisanship in the counting, but at least it maximizes the opportunity. Too funny that some jurisdictions won't let their process be observed.
Ron
Nothing received from Andrew Breitbart's organization should ever be taken as fact of anything. Just when he was alive the organization (and him) has absolutely no credibility whatever.
State's rights, voting rights act, assaination, Texas leading jerrymandering speading through usa, 2000 banana election. It's a war to return the pre-civ rights status quo; machine run citie&states, Jim Crow.
State's rights, voting rights act, assaination, Texas leading jerrymandering speading through usa, 2000 banana election. It's a war to return the pre-civ rights status quo; machine run citie&states, Jim Crow.
Bo, I suggest it's not safe to assume everyone can easily obtain copies of identity proofing documents. I once couldn't obtain a Georgia driver's licence because I didn't have my birth certificate handy. I was in the US Army and my documents weren't all with me. Now, if the birth certificate is overseas, there is another wrinkle. People lose things, it happens. And for many, replacing a lost document wasn't a priorty till identity verification became an issue.
As of October 30, 2010 the United States Department of State does not accept Puerto Rican birth certificates issued prior to July 1, 2010 as primary proof of citizenship for a U.S. passport. As someone who now works in identification verification, it isn't always as easy as some think. So a free drive is only good if a person has the documents a particular jurisdiction requires.
The commenter from North Carolina is partially right. In North Carolina there is a three person board on each county dependent on what party the governor is. In Chatham County the Board of Commissioners is majority Republican and very partisan. They've used their position to suppress the vote by limiting voting areas and cutting down on early voting periods. The fact is that Republicans know they can only win through undemocratic means and limiting citizens' ability to vote. I suspect the earlier caller was just unhappy that the Democratic Party and Obama for America was simply trying to expand voting to the widest range of eligible voters.
I'm also pretty familiar with technology, and I still think that e-voting can is achievable. I agree the implementations we've seen so far are all crap, but the necessary technology exists. Public-key cryptography and secure multi-party computation could allow us to have secure and verifiable electronic voting. Votes could be publicly counted and individuals could verify their own vote without compromising their identity or the identity of other voters.
I have more confidence in math than I do in people.
The United States doesn`t have too many voters coming out to vote,but not enough citizens voting.
When an elected member of Congress from ANY party or independent status makes a speech indicating that techniques of voter suppression have been an intended and successful goals, it confirms the outright thievery that goes with the political process. (e.g. the Pennsylvania House Leader Mike Terzi declaring voter ID laws would hand the election to Gov. Romney http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o32tF-S6K60)
Also,
"Non-partisan election official" = legendary fictional character / appears only in works of fantasy