Renewed Debate over the HPV vaccine
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2011-09-15/renewed-debate-over-hpv-vaccine
During Tuesday’s CNN tea party presidential nominee debate two of the candidates sparred over perhaps an unlikely issue: the HPV vaccine. Republican Congresswoman Michele Bachmann criticized Republican Governor Rick Perry for signing an executive order in 2007 requiring middle school age girls in the state of Texas to have the vaccine – an order that was subsequently blocked by the Texas state legislature. Her comments renewed debate over the risks and benefits of the HPV vaccine …and what role, if any, the government should have with regard to who gets vaccinated. Diane and her guests discuss benefits and risks of the HPV vaccine.
Guests
Dr. Roberta DeBiasi
pediatric infectious diseases physician at Children’s National Medical Center
Peter Sprigg
vice president for policy at the Family Research Council
Liz Szabo
reporter, USA Today
Dr. Renata Sanders
adolescent Health
general pediatrics and adolescent medicine,
Johns Hopkins Children's Center
Program Highlights
The vaccination that adolescents, mostly girls, get to protect against the sexually transmitted HPV virus is, again, in the news. In a Republican debate, Congresswoman Michele Bachmann alleged the vaccine could have very dangerous side effects. She faulted Gov. Rick Perry for once pushing that all sixth grade girls be vaccinated.
The Political Firestorm
Republican GOP presidential candidate Rick Perry came under fire from his fellow candidates during a recent debate because he had put forward an executive order attempting to mandate the HPV vaccine for school entry. When the Texas legislature opposed the measure, he didn't pursue it. But the broaching of the subject at the debate was what prompted Bachmann's comments about the alleged link between the vaccine and mental retardation.
Lack of Supporting Evidence for Side Effects
Diane asked the guests if there were any reports that demonstrated links between the HPV vaccine and developmental disorders like autism. The guests agreed that there is no existing research demonstrating any such links or causation. "In fact, the American Academy of Pediatrics came out with a statement discussing how the HPV vaccine has not been associated with mental retardation," Dr. Sanders said.
How HPV Works
According to Dr. Sanders, many people don't know that they have HPV, and it is often asymptomatic. About 90 percent of HPV infections clear naturally with no treatment in about 2 years. Dr. Debiasi noted that the virus is so common that about 50 percent of all sexually active people have some form of it. And Dr. Sanders pointed out that although the vast majority of cases resolve with no complications, there are some strains that are more likely to result in cancers, including some oral cancers.
Solutions Based in Behavior-Change
Sprigg makes a distinction between HPV and other viruses children are routinely vaccinated against, like measles and mumps. Sprigg says that since youth can protect themselves from HPV by abstaining from sexual contact, it is in a different category from the other diseases. Sprigg also believes that if a state does pass a law mandating vaccines, there should be an opt-in rather than opt-out system.
What is the Ideal Age-Range?
Dr. Sanders said that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recommends catch-up immunization or vaccination against the HPV infection in 13- to 26-year-olds. She also pointed out that there are studies looking at whether or not it can be used in even older woman because there's a big need for evidence to show whether or not it's as effective in the older population as it is in the younger population. Dr. Dibiasi noted that some people aren't aware that the vaccine is safe for boys, too.
Comments
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mchaun wrote:
"I'm not taking sides, but you ought to understand that we are subjected
to a constant Niagara of psuedo-scientific claptrap from richly rewarded
whores claiming to disprove numerous fears of dangers from materials,
processes and practices ."
Then if you think you know better, which apparently you do, feed and grow your own chickens. Don't get any vaccines. Don't own a TV set, microwave oven, or cell phone.
Simple.
Everything that "makes life easier" contains risks and costs.
Take the birth control pill, for example. Yes, there may be risks. But, no doubt, they have prevented millions of unwanted pregnancies, unwanted or handicapped children, and incalculable misery.
Not all richly rewarded whores are directly richly rewarded. Many more whores, like ecgbert, hope that by sucking up to their Imperial Masters, parroting their silly slogans, condemning regulation, for example, they will be richly (for them) rewarded by being allowed to wait under the Master's banquet table with the Master's Mastiffs to grab whatever crumbs that fall from the Table.
The FDA believes Arsenic may cause liver cancer. What if Arsenic is responsible for the Obesity Pandemic as well? Or the attendant Diabetes epidemic?
People have a right to know the facts not inane blowing off their concerns with your, "Everything that "makes life easier" contains risks and costs."
I'm beginning to wonder if you really may be a Racist. I don't have any evidence, but I smell the stink of your Right wing dismissal of anything that helps or protects the ordinary people and the Racism that seems to be endemic in your friends.
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
First, I'm gonna let the whole "whore" thing go, because I'm about to make a big enough fool out of you without it.
Logic - not your strong suit, mchaun. Let's break it down, shall we?
"People have a right to know the facts"
" What if Arsenic is responsible for the Obesity Pandemic as well? Or the attendant Diabetes epidemic?"
Yeah. But maybe it's Martians beaming fat molecules into people's bodies! What if it's actually brocolli and we've been wrong about it all along!
Your fundamental problem is, there's always a black helicopter over your head, and another conspiracy theory around the corner.
You wouldn't know a "fact" if it bit you in the arse, so let's see if we can educate you. "The FDA believes Arsenic may cause liver cancer". No, actually, "The FDA stressed that it did not think the increased arsenic in chicken posed a human health threat." The presence of inorganic arsenic may promote cancers. Chicken feed contains organic arsenic at levels that do not harm chickens, has been used for 70 years, and the FDA says it is safe. The FDA has a current concern that organic arsenic may be connected to increased levels of inorganic arsenic and therefore, Pfizer has taken it off the market.
Now, do you see the difference between factual information and "What if Arsenic is responsible for the Obesity Pandemic as well?"
So, having shown you to be not credible on the arsenic thing, and frankly, a little "out there", let's examine the "racist" charge, shall we, and see if there are any similarities.
"I'm beginning to wonder if you really may be a Racist. I don't have any evidence...."
Hmmm, sounds kinda like the "What if arsenic is respondible for the Obesity Pandemic as well" thing. No evidence for that either. In fact, you seem to have just pulled them both out of your arse.
"but I smell the stink of your Right wing dismissal of anything that helps or protects the ordinary people and the Racism that seems to be endemic in your friends"
Really? You want to try the "guilt by association" thing too, like Grady Lee Coward? I will tell you the same thing I told him. When you throw that charge around because you're out of ideas, you hurt people of color and only a moron would fail to see that.
What I smell is the stink of an off base conspiracy theorist, left-wing liberal progressive, who doesn't know his facts from a hole in the ground.
So, when you get your facts together - FACTS - demonstrable science - on the "arsenic causes obesity thing" ... or a SINGLE racist reference or idea in any of my posts, SHOW IT to us.
I'm not going to hold my breath.
You're the one who doesn't understand logic.
Your exposition of the "facts" of Arsenic in Poultry feed, is really nothing but parroting of opinions and/or speculations of others.
Yes, the FDA has finally realized after 70 years, that organic Arsenic has been converted to inorganic Arsenic in the bodies of the medicated poultry and the residues in the meat may cause Cancer in Humans.
Your paragraph states that FDA believes the Arsenic in poultry feed is safe then ends by acknowledging that it isn't.
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
Wow!! During these exchanges, NPR linked to an article,"Tempest In A Lunchbox: Arsenic Traces In Apple Juice", above in, "SIMILAR NPR STORIES".
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
I'd just like to add that, as a girl in her early 20s diagnosed with HPV and mild cervical changes, it's absolutely terrifying to hear the misinformation that has been thrown around in these debates. I'm all for getting children vaccinated for this disease, as it IS a pretty annoying thing to have. But it's hard to listen to Gardasil pushing their product as though it, alone, will save people from cervical cancer. HPV is by no means a death sentence if you don't miss your appointments. Plus, it is such a common disease. If you know a college aged girl and she didn't get ALL THREE shots there's a very high chance that she has HPV. I'm not promiscuous. I waited to become sexually active until I was over twenty and in a monogamous relationship. I've only had one partner, and I have HPV. Also, it is imperative that you get all three doses. I had two shots and thought I was at least partially protected, but that was clearly not the case.
"What does the CDC recommend?"
Does the CDC recommend a NHS like they have in Britain, healthcare for all Americans, first dollar coverage like Brits have? If not, the CDC is political and not scientific and should be ignored.
I meet working people every day diseased from being underinsured. I just met a young man WORKING at La Quinta who did not go to the doctor when he started losing his sight. His insurance has big deductibles. The visit to the primary care physician would have cost him a day's wages. A visit to a eye specialist would have cost him two days wages.
He is blind in one eye now. Where do you stand, CDC, on stories like these?
Another interesting Gardasil related issue is the demonstration project that was being run in India to try and bring the HPV vaccine into the fold there. The project was suspended by the Indian government following a number of questionable deaths and opposition from local female advocacy groups. More here:
http://english.aljazeera.net/programmes/faultlines/2011/07/2011711112453...
mchaun wrote:
"Your exposition of the "facts" of Arsenic in Poultry feed, is really nothing but parroting of opinions and/or speculations of others."
Yeah. Major news sources and the FDA itself ... even the Huffington Post!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/08/arsenic-chicken_n_873299.html
Try Googling "arsenic poultry fda".
Educate yourself about the difference between organic and inorganic arsenic and what the FDA says about each and their relation to poultry production in this country.
Then get back to me.
mchaun, you are a conspiracy theorist and a fear monger ... First Class.
No one would object to Gardasil if it was effective at preventing cervical cancer and if it was safe. I recently received a letter from the CDC's Dr.Markowitz which confirmed that still they do not have any evidence that Gardasil will prevent cervical cancer. Go to my website at www.gardasil-and-unexplained-deaths.com for details. Assertions by your guests stating the vaccines will prevent cervical cancer as well as other types of cancer are speculative and unsubstantiated. Regarding safety, as others have noted, rates of adverse events are calculated deceptively and are not properly investigated. The CDC does not even contact victims. A report was released just last week by Sanevax.org that HPV DNA contamination was found in all lots of Gardasil tested by an independent lab. Merck and the CDC have heretofore insisted that there is no HPV DNA contamination in the vaccine which is also bound to the aluminum adjuvant. It is known this could produce tumors, anaphylaxis or autoimmune disorders. My daughter DIED from an autoimmune response to Gardasil.
"ecgberht wrote:
mchaun wrote:
"Your exposition of the "facts" of Arsenic in Poultry feed, is really nothing but parroting of opinions and/or speculations of others."
Yeah. Major news sources and the FDA itself ... even the Huffington Post!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/08/arsenic-chicken_n_873299.html"
"Try Googling "arsenic poultry fda".
The Huffington Post???? "the FDA Itself"???
Well Miss Smarta_s, then you should know that the FDA has not ever made, supported or recognized any studies on residues of Arsenic in food animals or Humans.
Your carelessly paraphrased quotes from the Huff Post and FDA are mere opinion.
"Educate yourself about the difference between organic and inorganic arsenic and what the FDA says about each and their relation to poultry production in this country.
Then get back to me.
mchaun, you are a conspiracy theorist and a fear monger ... First Class.
September 16, 2011 - 9:45 am"
I'm well aware of the differences in organic and inorganic Arsenic. You apparently don't and can't even read it properly.
You wrote,"The FDA has a current concern that organic arsenic may be connected to increased levels of inorganic arsenic and therefore, Pfizer has taken it off the market".
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
"Well Miss Smarta_s, then you should know that the FDA has not ever made, supported or recognized any studies on residues of Arsenic in food animals or Humans. Your carelessly paraphrased quotes from the Huff Post and FDA are mere opinion. "
That is simply FALSE.
Did you even look at the link? I'll post it again. Recommend you read the article. It says in part, "In the study of 100 chickens, the FDA found ..."
so the FDA has done IT's OWN study contrary to your fantasy.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/08/arsenic-chicken_n_873299.html
I picked HP (out of litterally dozens of similar reports) because I figured to a liberal like you, it, Daily Kos, and Mother Jones would be sufficiently reliable sources.
"You apparently don't and can't even read it properly."
You're wrong again! What the study shows is that (naturally ocurring) organic arsenic is safe in current amounts in our chickens. Inorganic arsenic is not and increased levels are being linked to chickens on the Phizer feed. If "organic arsenic is connected to INCREASED levels of inorganic arsenic" that's a bad thing. That's why Pfizer took the feed off the market.
http://www.fda.gov/AnimalVeterinary/SafetyHealth/ProductSafetyInformatio...
Got it?
To ecgberht:
I'll bet you can defend this one too-
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/16/us/suit-accuses-baltimore-institute-of...
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
mchaun wrote:
"I'll bet you can defend this one too-"
Why would I? It's a law suit. A jury will decide if Kennedy Krieger is guilty or not. If you'd like to convict them based on press reports, that's your privelege, but it get's back to that whole "facts" thing again, doesn't it?
BTW, did you know they receive Federal Funding for their research?
But, nice try to change the subject. What I was hoping you were responding to was, "you should know that the FDA has not ever made, supported or recognized any studies on residues of Arsenic in food animals or Humans. Your carelessly paraphrased quotes from the Huff Post and FDA are mere opinion. "
I'll have to assume you're retracting that statement?
I made some assertions about Arsenic in chicken feed and you had to stick your nose into something you knew nothing about and now are scrambling to save face in front of your Diane Rehm Friends.
For all of your blabbering, you have not rebutted my original claim.
I don't want to make Diane mad with these protracted debates on her site, so if you want to continue the discussion off-line send me an EMail.
I have said all I am going to say on this site on this subject except-
"You're wrong again! What the study shows is that (naturally ocurring) organic arsenic is safe in current amounts in our chickens. Inorganic arsenic is not and increased levels are being linked to chickens on the Phizer feed. If "organic arsenic is connected to INCREASED levels of inorganic arsenic" that's a bad thing. That's why Pfizer took the feed off the market."
This paragraph is irredeemable S__t and you are showing your abyssmal ignorance again.
"Naturally occuring Arsenic" IS NOT ORGANIC and irrelevant to the quote you so carelessly paraphrased.
Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com
Uh ... I've posted links to FDA to substantiate everything I've posted on this subject, including a study you said DIDN'T EXIST! I've heard nothing but opinion from you including this, ""Naturally occuring Arsenic" IS NOT ORGANIC "
"I made some assertions about Arsenic in chicken feed and you had to stick your nose into something you knew nothing about and now are scrambling to save face in front of your Diane Rehm Friends."
You're the one scrambling mchaun, and now trying to quash the discussion on the board to hide your ignorance. If you aren't willing to do the research to defend your point, I'd recommend keeping your OPINION to yourself.
"This paragraph is irredeemable S__t and you are showing your abyssmal ignorance again."
Really? PROVE IT. SHOW US THE EVIDENCE!!! Not just what ya THINK! Your OPINION does not count!
"I suppose its too late to get the HPV vaccine?" That was the first thing I said to my doctor after being diagnosed with Invasive Cell Sarcoma. So now for me it's surgery plus six weeks of chemo therapy and radiation therapy.
Six weeks of systemic chemo therapy an radiation. Over the last two weeks I have been trying to figure out which is going to be the worst of these two treatments. Both of my Oncologists have been very honest in preparing me for what am am about to undergo starting next Monday. In a couple of weeks I will know, but for now I am just focusing on each day. I know that there will be a beginning and an end to my treatment and my goal is to make it through each day until I reach the end so I can start to recover.
The HPV vaccine wasn't around when I was younger. Parents today though can elect to have their children vaccinated. I am hoping they do. I get that parents don't want to think about their children having sex. They especially don't want to think about it when their children are so young. But children grow up. This is not about teenage sex. Its about adults having normal, healthy relationships with their partners throughout their lives. HPV passes from skin to skin contact. It can be passed not just during sex. Unless you can guarantee that your children will only be with one person their entire lives, they need to be vaccinated.
I'm writing this today as a cancer patient. My cancer was caused by HPV. I was married and got divorced. I didn't play around and I never remarried. I do not know who I got the HPV virus from. It doesn't matter to me now.
In a few months, after I get through all of this and become a cancer survivor, after I go through all of the pain and suffering I need to go through to get to that point, I will post again.
Think about my words.
Sincerely,
Robert