The U.S.Ten Years After 9/11
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2011-09-08/usten-years-after-911
A decade ago the United States suffered an enormous blow: the September 11th attacks killed nearly three thousand people in New York, Washington, D.C., and Shanksville, Pennsylvania. The tragedy led to the start of two wars abroad and an enormous effort to boost security at home. The U.S. has since experienced a massive financial meltdown and is now suffering through a persistently meager economic recovery and an increasingly partisan political divide. Join us for a conversation on how this country has changed since 9/11 and why.
Guests
James Thurber
professor and director of the Center for Congressional and Presidential Studies at American University; author of "Obama in Office: The First Two Years."
David Wessel
economics editor, The Wall Street Journal; author "In Fed We Trust"
Laura Murphy
director, ACLU Washington Legislative Office
Comments
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The terrorist attacks of 2001 were never about what the terrorists could do to us but what we we would do to ourselves in response. Unfortunately the country chose the path of cowardice in the face of the enemy. Public sentiment was one of extreme over reaction, an emotional and childish view of the true threat that faced our country. The public was willing and still is ready to hand over any freedom for the illusion of security. I suppose this comes from the nanny state mentality that developed in the last century that the purpose of government was to take care of us. We can only hang our heads in shame when we acknowledge how weak we have become as a people. In 2011 I see a ripple of backlash to the ineffective and demeaning security measures the government has forced upon us but realize if there is even a mildly successful terrorist attack we will once again return to the fear and loathing that permeated the atmosphere of 2001 and beyond. By any reasonable measure we can only conclude that we have lost the "war on terror"
@ Monte:
Yes, too many people are willing to trade liberty for security--and we know what Ben Franklin had to say about those folks: they would lose both, and deserve neither.
But how do you blame this on the "nanny state mentality"? Is that just your catch-all for everything you hate? Real "nanny state" liberals (meaning those of us on the left who believe that society as a whole has a responsibility to take care of everyone, not just leaving every fool to fend for themselves) have been amongst the loudest voices decrying such monstrosities as the Patriot Act, and calling for reasoned responses to an overhyped yet genuine threat. Reactionaries are the ones generally who are so afraid of a few radical Islamists that they're willing to embrace radical Christian militia types or hardcore "intelligence gathering" (or even both, sometimes!) in order to feel secure.
There are still many unanswered questions about 9-11 that have not been closely examined by the media. For instance, military jets rapidly deploy to investigate every plane that veers off course, yet on 9-11 FOUR commercial flights were hijacked and where was the military? NYC and Washington are surrounded by military air facilities ... so what happened on that day? Suppose all four planes had targeted Washington and succeeded?! What happened to our air defenses on 9-11, and why hasn't the media gotten to the bottom of this?
@joshua
Yea, I was with Monte until he threw in the "nanny state" catch all phrase.
Our countries actions over the last 10 years has made it hard for me to still have the same sense of loss that I had when 9/11 happened. Every time I see the victims families and survivors of the 9/11 attacks talk about what happened, my mind immediately goes to all the faceless, nameless, voiceless victims of the hundreds or maybe thousands of lesser 9/11 attacks that we have let loose on innocent people throughout the world. The bombing of cities, the drone attacks, and just last week we learned the execution of very young children by our military*. It is very sad, even sickening that this continues to be done in all our names, with no end in sight.
Tom in NC
*Source; http://news.antiwar.com/2011/08/29/cables-reveal-2006-summary-execution-...
You go hang your head in shame Monte, while we move on, 'as a people'. Of course we overreacted, how can a country not freak out when something like 9/11 happens.
9/11 and subsequent conspiracies in behalf of Oligarchy; Dick Cheney is still bragging about it.
"roland wrote:
You go hang your head in shame Monte, while we move on, 'as a people'. Of course we overreacted, how can a country not freak out when something like 9/11 happens"
Hey Rolo:
I kinda made the same comment more less from your comment from last week when you stated. "The Republicans are giving the finger to the People. That was so absurd on the part of you.
Ten years after, half the U.S. population still believes 911 was an inside job...and Israel Zionist still controls Congress.
I don’t see how anyone can say that the Iraq war was caused by 9/11 – there is so much evidence that the administration wanted to invade Iraq long before that. The war was an atrocity that in many ways has contributed to the level of suicide bombings around the world.
David R. Quammen
1054 31st St NW
Washington, DC 20007
202.342.6230
How many people did we kill in Afghanistan and Iraq under the guise of taking the war to them? How much did we give up, to "stay safe"? Our lives have changed forever because we allowed extremist foreign and domestic to claim our lives. I do not cherish the possibility that my email can be read for no real reason, I do not cherish having to take my shoes off at airports every time I fly. The big question is, are we more secure because of what happened? I think the answer is no. We hate each other at a level that seemed out of the question before the events of 9/11/2001.
I disagree with the gentleman stating that " no one could have predicted that we would be in Afghanistan/ Iraq for a decade" and that " not one would predict that we would have spend 1.5 trillion dollars on those wars" In fact, there were many people at the on-set who predicted, fully knowing the history & cultures of those countries, that those wars would become protracted "Vietnam-like" wars of this generation. It was a dis-service to our society and economy for the Bush administration to enter into those engagements without being honest with the american public and planning for a way to pay for them! It is a dis-service to americans today to propagate a history stating that no one could have predicted….
I don't disagree that we should have gone into Afghanistan but be honest with the american people about the need, the extent of the sacrifice and the costs. WE are adults, they are OUR children serving and living with the bloody outcomes and the economic crippling. We deserve straight talk.
@DRQuammen:
I agree. That was another example of the administration "creating" a different history in order to justify what they considered pre-ordained actions to serve their unspoken goals, goals that had nothing to do with the security, economic health and development of our nation.
Listening to the panel regarding homeland security and the cost to the USA makes me wonder if it is the politicians alone who are driving this fear and insecurity or a combination of religion, voters, and politicians.
We talk about the horrific results of 9/11. But we do not talk about the core reasons for the hatred that has been and is continuing to be directed towards the US. Former head of the CIA's Bin laden unit Micheal Scheuer and many others address the core reasons for the hatred....occupations, invasions, support for dictators, support for Israel no matter what they do, our military based on Muslim land protecting our access to their oil. Scheuer has said over and over again that they do not hate us for our freedoms they hate us for our foreign policy and the results.
Why not talk about these core issues? The reasons for the hatred and efforts to kill us
Diane, What has changed in the social world we know as the USA. I say we have seen the purchasing value of the dollar that honest citizens earn each day dramatically drop and we find a culture for the first time where the value of self interest is placed first over any sense of civic leadership and positive legacy. The industry "leaders" of today have by and large failed our society.
One of then things I have been suprised about has been how little has changed after 9-11. While there have been some changes, if you compare the nation reacted after December 7th and how they reacted after September 11 th, you'd hardly believe this was the same country. During World War 2, there was a massive increase in enlistment, the nation sacrificed through rationing, and there were massive increases in taxes to pay for the war. With September 11th, for the first time in U.S. history, taxes were reduced and we were told to go to the mall. The wars were left to the military and no one outside the military has been asked to sacrifice.
The US has changed in very predictable ways, along lines that Noam Chomsky laid out from the beginning. What a shame that he is not on this program to discuss this topic! How tragic and childish that public and commercial media are afraid to let us hear our greatest living intellectual discuss issues of vital importance to us.
I'm old enough to remember the outrage after Watergate and the John Dean library card when we found out that the government could obtain a list of the books we checked out from a library. 40 years later our bank accounts can be perused by government agencies, our internet browsing can be searched, our credit card purchases are readily available , and the list goes on and on. We accept all this sheeplike in the name of security. Satellites and security cameras can track our every move....Are we becoming a police state?
The majority of our leaders like to say that radical Muslims "hate us for our freedoms" Yet former head of the CIA's Bin Laden unit Micheal Scheuer, former weapons inspector Scott Ritter, Former President Jimmy Carter, and many others tell us that the reason that there is so much hatred and efforts to kill us is because of US foreign policy and the results of that foreign policy. Decades long support for dictators, support for Israel no matter what they do, occupation, invasions, and US military bases on Muslim land to protect our access to their oil.
When are we going to talk about the core reasons for the hatred which has turned into inexcusable and deadly violence?
Monte makes some good points. The terrorist attacks were on their own, huge attacks on us, American people (of all colors and backgrounds). And also there have been incredible repercussions. It is interesting to hear that We the people's reaction of "let's do something drastic." is seen as wanting the nanny state to do something. The state is still us. It is Our National Guard and professional military who was sent over there. I think that was a subversive and anti-democratic move by the (Republican) powers at the time. someone there says the wars cost We the People, 1.7 Trillion $$. That is 1.7 Thousand Billion Dollars I believe. The amount spent on "Homeland Security" he pegged at $700,000. That is like, almost 3/4 of 1 Billion dollars. Different isn't it? Then the lady from is it ACLU seems to have taken the polarized stand that , "We are all being watched so much more. There is suspicion based on looks or obvious religious affiliation." and so forth. Well this is true, and it has had some over use by some "law enforcers." But we are now living in a Much more Monitored time! FaceBook is keeping track of us. No doubt even the Diane Rehm comment site has some manners of surveillance. And, as Juan Williams says, some people -right or wrong- will be feeling a little off . We can get used to this. It is the small potatoes in the deal. Look at the 1.7 Thousand Billion dollars going to defense contractors and not to the rest of society, who are suffering in what someone this morning called "The Second Great Contraction" of our economy as a whole.
Former head of the CIA's Bin Laden Unit Micheal Scheuer writes that Al Qeada is stronger than ever.
That Bin Laden had set up a movement that could withstand the loss of his life as well any other Al Qeada leaders.
http://nationalinterest.org/article/zawahiri-era-5732?page=3
The Zawahiri Era
From the
Sept-Oct 2011
issue
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Michael Scheuer
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August 24, 2011
Armored in emboldened doctrine and rejuvenated recruits, al-Qaeda has now moved on to the training and implementation stage of its next attack pattern. As al-Qaeda in Iraq works to reclaim lost ground and allies, it is using attacks that fit the definition of targetable Muslims and cover the gamut of smaller operations. Oil pipelines, storage tanks and electrical-distribution assets have been sabotaged; military, security and police bases, stations and recruiting offices have all been hit by bombings and/or small-group assaults, as have national and provincial government ministries; and assassinations of government officials, bureaucrats, senior security officers and Sunni tribal chiefs working with the Baghdad regime have become part of daily life. (It is worth noting that Fort Hood and at least four U.S. military recruiting posts have been attacked by domestic Islamists in the last few years.) Iraq today has allowed al-Qaeda to practice, refine and teach (via the Internet) its host of revised tactics. Given the multinational makeup of al-Qaeda’s force in Iraq, there is no reason to doubt that those who graduate from this school will be sent abroad to ply their lethal trade.
My concern is the huge increase of police and security guards in Washington since 9/11. I go to the Department of Labor often. There are a half dozen guards at every entrance. You may not enter without someone coming down to pick you up. Thiis has greatly limited on the communication between staff and the outside world. But there is a freeway running beneath the main building and a street under one wing. A terrorist would have little trouble blowing the place up from outside. But what terrorist group would want to attack the Department of Labor. The irony is that the National Gallery of Art across the street with its billions of dollars in fine art. The gallery very sensibly check your bags and lets you in without any hassle. Besides, it used to be that the Capital used to be the peoples' house and now its is a fortress unavailable to the public.
Seems like our nation is suffering a crisis of confidence and hopefully conscience.
To me the most important change is the huge amount of both blood and treasure we have spent in what I see as a futile effort to make us "safe." My first thought on September 11 was that UBL had warned us that he would destroy what he perceived to be the most important parts of the American way of life.
I believe he achieved his goal, for he saw the economy as being the thing most important to us. By causing the country to spend huge sums, we are as I see it weaker and without any real advance in security. If this was his goal, it has been achieved, we have given up civil rights for a kabuki dance of dubious worth. Had we said no, we are not in fear and we will not be forced into a panic as a country we would be much better off.
Not too long before these attacks occurred, I looked around the world and asked how long the rest of the world would let us continue to live the way we do, to keep propping up tyrannical despots, private corporations with armies to protect their financial interests, etc., so we can keep consuming via the resources we need from their countries in order to keep fueling the American materialism regardless of how others suffer because of it.
It wasn't long before I got my answer on Sept. 11, 2001.
If we really want peace and freedom from these kinds of attacks, we must first be able to allow others to also enjoy them rather than pay the real price for ours.
Bet if you had a kid who joined the military because of the Bush administrations pack of lies and they were dead or injured for life you might just feel a bit different. If you were an Iraqi and hundreds of thousands of people around you were killed, injured and millions displaced as a direct result of that invasion. You might just feel a bit different about that invasion.
Too bad for some people it takes directly experiencing a deep loss or losing a leg for them to get that rich men will send young men off to an unnecessary war based on a pack of lies.
Oh I know "move on, turn the page, next chapter, don't be about vengeance, witch hunts, retribution" That is what so many of our leaders and reps keep repeating.
But someone please tell me at what point did holding people accountable for very serious crimes start being defined as "retribution" and not justice?
Great Show Ms. Rehm:
I have been a follower of your show for more than 15 years which made feel entitled to ask you for a favor: Could you address with one of your panels my conspiracy theory about the Iraq War: I believe that it was a smoke screen to justify the ELECTION of GWB (I don't consider it ELECTION because the winner was Al Gore, but you don't have to address this part). A basic principle in politics (since the times of Napoleon) is that you don't change horses in the middle of the stream. His advisors knew that been at war would be a good reason to keep him in power. It is naive to think that nobody in his inner circle was aware that the real threat were the Taliban and Al Qaeda. If they decided to ignore this fact probably was because of greed: To make more money with a never-ending war.
Thank you also for so many years of great journalism and for keeping a perspective of what information should be as apposed to political brain washing of uninformed listeners.
It's only justice when the powerful define it that way, Kathleen. All the attacks on Afghanistan from the start, and subsequently on Iraq, were about nothing BUT retribution. True justice doesn't kill or main the innocent.
I'm sorry if you have suffered a loss, I too had a nephew injured in Afghanistan.
Wishing you peace,
Monica
Internationally the country's image has greatly improved under Obama despite the drone attacks. But until we lean on Israel heavily to get a Palestinian-Israeli agreement we will still be seen as a pawn of the Israelis.
We have a complete double standard when it comes to human rights. This hurts. We rightly condemn Assad for killing unarmed Syrian civilians but make no mention of Israeli killing of unarmed Syrian civilians on the same day. We have let go unpunished the massive invasions of neighbors by Israel but went ot war against Saddam Hussein for the same thing. As long as we let Israel direct our foregoing policy we will have trouble the middle east and elsewhere.
Do you think it bothers people around the world that the majority of Americans do not want to look at the core reasons often expressed for the anger and hatred directed towards the US? Decades long support for dictators, support for Israel no matter what they do, invasions based on a pack of lies which resulted in hundreds of thousands dead, injured and millions displaced that Americans barely whisper about, US military bases on Muslim soil to protect our access to their oil.
Do you think they continue to be angry because we do not really discuss the real reasons for the anger?