Vermont Debates Universal Health Care
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2011-04-27/vermont-debates-universal-health-care
Vermont lawmakers have advanced a bill that would make it the first state to adopt universal health care. The governor, Peter Shumlin, has made this a key part of his agenda. Diane and her guests, including the governor, discuss the ongoing debate over strategies to expand health care access and reduce costs.
Guests
Julie Rovner
health policy correspondent for NPR, author of "Health Care Policy and Politics A-Z," and contributing editor for National Journal Daily.
Governor Peter Shumlin
Vermont's Democratic governor, leading efforts to create a single-payer health care system in the state.
Dr. Robert Zarr
pediatrician at the Unity Health Care, Inc., in Washington, DC, co-chair of the DC chapter of Physicians for a National Health Program, and adjunct professor at Children’s National Medical Center, George Washington University, and Georgetown University.
Michael Cannon
director of health policy studies, Cato Institute
Comments
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We have rationed are now with insurance. Only 32% of my childs dr prescribed monthly medication is paid by our insurance. The rational given is that Blue Cross does not believe my child should receive the dosage prescribed by the Dr she has had her whole life. A friend of mines child had gallbladder surgery due to months of terrible pain and based on months of Dr visits. The surgery was disallowed. They are contesting.
Health care cost must me addressed but until we address the for profit insurance, there is little hope.
Seems that we need to add more doctors too. That supply continues to shrink compared to the demand. Adding healthcare professionals should decrease the demand in such a way to help lower costs. Number of docs doesn't follow market dynamics. Another cog to the whole problem.
One of the simplest reasons The Diane Rehm Show will never be able to continue to draw an audience without government subsidy is apparent in this segment. The producers and host are just not bright enough to dig down to the level where health care costs actually originate, the health care providers themselves. So, without having to compete in the radio marketplace, just trotting out the left wing "evil insurance company" tropes is enough to phone it in for government-funded NPR. Meanwhile, in the real world, the health care sector continues to vacuum up, at excellent profits, every dollar provided to them. Hmmm...how could they vacuum up even MORE dollars? Why, by making paying them the rates they demand the law of the land, funded by every taxpayer in the nation. Then, guaranteed their income as well, just like the DR Show, they, too, could just phone in the treatment, just like the DR Show does. Brilliant! I bet Hollywood or Wall Street wishes they could get that sort of sweetheart deal. Unfortunately, if Hollywood or Wall Street don't perform at the cutting edge of their abilities, every day, they'll fail, and lose everything.
Over half of all of the fraud in the False Claims cases brought by the federal government are health care based. The HMO's and the drug industry are the biggest cheats in health care. We must find a way to control the charges of HMO's and drug companies. They are paying their managers millions of dollars giving them great health care and the rest of us struggle to pay our health care bills. Thousands of citizens do not have any health care because they can not afford it.
Check out the Taxpayers Against Fraud (TAF) website a group that followers False Claims cases and see who the top cheats are in the health care industry.
Why do you have the Cato Institute on your program because they are a right wing talking group. They are an intelligent group of people but they ignore the truth and replace it with what is best for corporations and the public's needs are ignored
The average person in the US does not understand our health care system, and just the fact that we need Medicare underscores the problems with current system.
Most of our healthcare costs are not paid for by private insurance companies, and basically the federal government is subsidizing insurance company profits.
Once you develop a chronic illness you become uninsurable and you will be dumped from the risk pool. Most of the chronically ill had insurance at one point, and our system rations when people need care the most.
We allow insurance companies to cherry pick who they will insure, and basically let them cover the most profitable people. So why do we need them at all? psst, we don't.
I am a totally disabled veteran, and I have been dropped by every insurance carrier I have ever had. And now I cannot even get private insurance. Ironically, they had no problem covering me when I actually didn't need care, but once I needed care: poof, they claimed every condition I had was a result of military service and ineligble for coverage.
Time was, when private insurance picked up most of the health care costs, but that is no longer true. Today it is Medicare that foots the bill so that private insurance can cut back on hospital procedure in-patient days.
Hi Diane, I am Jim from Brighton, and was on your August 26 show stating that dispersants are crazy and used to hide the massive amounts of oil that were gushing out.
I am a former Air Force Liutenant at the end of the Korean war and needed surgery for a cyst. It was removed by Colonel Shear, The astronauts doctor at splash down.
My fiend is a famous nurse and one ot the top few in the nation for medical mistakes and outcomes and for 50 years we both feel that the VA and military hospitals are recognized as the best sysyem in the USA and by President Obama recently.
Expanding VA and Military coverage for the immediate familys of Veterans and Active Duty militaty will be a good pilot to eventually cover the entire country eliminating the 2 insurance workers for each medical worker and have a single payer, the Dept of Defense, now defending the health of Americans and supporting freedom loving countries and Human rights.
10:35 AM Wed 27th APRIL 2011
BOOK : THE TRUTH ABOUT GETTING SICK IN AMERICA; The Real Problems With Health Care And What We Can Do (October 2010) by Dr Tim Johnson
Also the comparative plans book by James Fallows - which won't appear in searches for some reason.
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Now, Americans who care, need to immediately build many sanitariums (Trump Therapy Towers) where we can protect the millions of Birth-ers.
It is time to practice tough love and safely protect and treat the mentally ill Birth-er. To allow these poorly trained adult-reasoning minds to operate refineries, power generating plants, water purification plants, or even machine shop tools - where their inability to reason as adults could harm themselves or their neighbors - is not a neighborly thing to do.
I am sorry to see the release of the birth certificate. Now we won't be easily able to identify the mentally ill by the simple question, ''Where do you think the president was born?'' Loosing this easy, and 100% effective, test for detecting someone with treatable, mental illnesses is a great loss.
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The World War American Generation apparently didn't give to their children their ability to discern the true and the false. Let us hope this skill skipped to their grandchildren.
I'd welcome the grand social experiment. Let Vermont enact this legislation, then let's all observe: do the providers stay or flee?; do residents seek health care outside the state?; does industry flock to the state?; do college grads flock to the state?; does everyone's blood cholesterol levels decline?; rate of heart attacks and stroke decline? Single payor inevitably results in limited access. When the payor is already billions if not trillions of dollars in debt, payments are reduced and the only providers are those willing to be employed or state-owned. Personally, I like knowing that if I need highly specialized care, there are world-renowned doctors and hospitals here in America with the latest technology who can help me now, provide services for which my insurance pays, and who may make a boatload of money extending my life. That goal will never be shared by a single payor government agency run by lifer bureaucrats whose only concern is securing their pension. But hey, Mr Shumlin and Ms Rehm...prove me wrong.
GROWTH OF HEALTH CARE COSTS ACROSS 30 COUNTRIES
Mr. Cannon, you are completely wrong about the rate of health care cost growth across other countries compared to the United States.
And, Ms. Rovner, you are completely wrong to back him up on that statement.
Each of you should know to not make statements that are such dramatic errors.
Take a look at this graph to see the truth: the facts. (30 countries)
http://mforall.org/p/885
And there's more here ... (Canada)
http://mforall.org/p/807
As you see, the United States is the ONLY free-market country in the world with out-of-control costs.
Please get your act together. As Governor Shumlin indicated, your information is simply wrong.
See more facts: http://mforall.org/p/997
Bob Haiducek, Bob the Health and Health Care Advocate
http://mforall.org/p/200
Okay, I'm only going to say this once: cut social spending, raise taxes on the poor, and transfer the wealth to Wall Street's elite since they deserve it.
Now why is that so hard to understand?
Yours truly,
Ayn
How can using a single payer system ensure privacy? Ultimately, with the ever changing political environment in America, will there not someday be a list of people tied to illnesses or diseases? How can this be avoided to ensure the single payer system isn't the gateway to Americans losing their privacy?
Why are the much beloved insurance companies afraid of an alternative?Will single payer expose the fraud and resulting huge profits of the insurance industry? Why can't single payer and private insurance coexist? If the answer is that single payer will be more attractive to the consumer, does that not make a convincing argument for implementation? Of course, if health care can be nationalized, who's to say the same can't be done for our domestic energy?
Diane, i too want to comment on your show today. how wonderful that the governor of Vermont is bold enough to tackle this mess in the us health care delivery. as a Canadian now living in the us for past 15 years, i applaud the governor's statement of the need to take what's good in the other developed countries, and run with it. only in this country have we handed health care to insurance companies -- who's first priority is to make money! and as a nurse for nearly 30 years, i can tell you of all the waste i have seen here in the US simply to prevent law suits -- and i can also tell you many sad stories with the uninsured i have witnessed down here in Arizona. keep going with this governor -- and i so hope that the state of Vermont (which, by the way, coming from Quebec, i have visited many times) will be the role model for all states to follow.
Only have time for a “quickie” right now. So here are a few points to consider.
1) Its been said that in our federal system of governments the States are the “laboratories of democracy” - meaning different ideas should be tried at the State level before adopting any on the Federal level. For the past two years that has been the conservative cry, along with the slogan of “State’s Rights”, yet here we have a conservative bitterly opposing an attempt by a State (Vermont) to apply these principles - as it is allowed to do under the new health care law. Why?
It seems to me this is the best of all possible worlds for the conservative cause. Vermont is going one way, and Arizona is planning to go the other. Its Legislature just passed a law allowing out-of-state health insurers to sell policies in Arizona without being regulated there - exactly what conservatives favor. So, between Vermont and Arizona we will have an experiment to see which approach works better. Why are conservatives (represented by Mr. Cannon) so opposed to this? Could it be they fear the Vermont plan will work?
2) On the “NPR is biased” front: notice that Ms. Rovner (the NPR guest) agreed with Mr. Cannon on the issue of health costs rising at the same rate throughout the world. Notice, too, that she disagreed with him on other matters. (Ditto for comments by the more “liberal” guests - she agreed in part and disagreed in part). Wow! It’s almost like she was doing her job as a serious and objective journalist. Guess what? NPR may lean toward the left, but that doesn’t mean its reporting is biased!
Ciao for now!
How will the state handle other issues that contribute to high cost, i.e. malpractice insurance and high specialist salaries?
I have been a Single Payer advocate for many years now. It's evident that health care is a right and our country provides health care for the poor. But others can face bankruptcy for health care costs, even those who have health insurance. In my estimation Single Payer is the only way to stop the extortion being committed by the health care insurance industry. In this regard, it's a social justice issue. People pay exorbitant amounts of money in premiums and are stll responsible for co-pays, deductibles, co-insurance and the like. Health Insurance Companies are responsible for the ever increasing costs of health care. For those who object to Single Payer saying that it contrasts to our philosophy of a free enterprise system, I say, it's the health insurance companies that keep doctors from practicing in a free enterprise system. Doctors' charges can only be the amount the insurance companies dictate. And if they refuse to have multiple contracts with multiple insurance companies, they have no patients. To those who object to Single Payer saying we don't want socialized medicine, I say, we want socialized insurance, not socialized medicine.
Thank you, Vermont, for your sane efforts in correcting this most serious problem.
It's obscene that people profit from providing health care services to others. Every citizen is entitle to health care as a right. The profits of oil companies are equally obscene. And we all deserve reasonably priced energy. Let's nationalize health care and energy for the good of all. Oh, and we need food, so let's ensure reasonably priced food for all and eliminate the profits of those evil 'for profit' grocery store chains, restaurants and farmers. Lemme see, we all need shelter too. I'm tired of seeing the huge houses that homebuilders live in from them profiting off of our need for shelter. And I hear all of these companies employ people and some even provide benefits. Well we can't have any more of that nonsense. Let's have a society that allows Hollywood actors and pro sports figures to make $$millions, but eliminates the profit associated with health care, energy, housing and food. Oh wait, clothing and transportation. The Constitution ensures of those too doesnt it? Well we can't have profit there either then. Let's just make the government the one universal employer.
Typical NPR and Diane Rehm program --- a four to one imbalance in the guests. I know, I've been the single opponent to what DR and NPR are trying to promote and well recall actually being hushed by Diane when I was trying to compete with all the others. Remember the government already dominates half of the health system in the US. If the system is so broken then government is already largely responsible. So why in the world would we want to give the other half to the government? I'll take my chances with the private part of the system or preferably with an all private system with the government providing a safety net for those who need it. If there are problems with the insurance companies at least I can sue them. When the government starts rationing it cannot be sued and politics will game the system. The idea that the Vermont government or any government can provide an efficient system is absolutely laughable -- all the evidence is to the contrary. Diane let's have a show with two spokespersons for a government health system and two against without your bias involved rather than a show on how best to grow the government?
Medical records privacy is a myth. If you use any health insurance, then everyone, including your HR department has access to your records. Pharmacies report scripts to drug companies so they know which doctors to reward.
Even better, insurance companies report your medical claims to a "medical credit service" so they can compare your claims. And also see if you are lying when you file in the future or have a pre-existing condition.
The only person who does not have access to your records are the people in your family. which is ironic, since a clerk at your insurance company can talk all day with anyone in your HR department about your health, yet ifyour spouse or child calls they will claim privacy.
Funny, the ADA does not include HIPPA, or any medical records privacy. So to get any accommodation you have to basically give "private" records to any moron or they can deny your accommodation.
The Canadian Health Care system is looking better everyday.
Your guests should familiarize themselves with the European system of healthcare a little better....especially with the less known FACTS.
For example : in France you might have to wait 4 to 5 months for .....let's say - hip surgery / because of a waiting list.
Then again if you are willing to give the surgeon some money under the table...you could very easily get bumped to the top of the list...
Now is that what we , in the USA , want ? I hope not ! No system is perfect and we are all aware of it, but we need to really study the pitfalls of the systems that have been in place in other countries for a long time !
You got it. Becky!
And Tom agrees
Canadians do not get free healthcare. They pay for it with taxes - most will tell you they pay about 45% in taxes. Should be verified.
to Jim Davis:
There is nothing wrong with doctors, nurses, hospitals, even drug companies if the profits are reasonable, earning a "profit" for their services. There is NO reason why middle men health insurance companies should be making a profit off our illnesses - they do nothing to make us healthier or improve health care- they only siphon off our health care dollars. They are blood-sucking vampires.
Excellent program Diane, I hope the governor is successful.
For heavens sakes, if we put men on the moon, how come
we can't solve the health care problem?
I was amazed at the comparison by Julie Rovner, between the organized and well thought out rationing done by other countries and the US's abject abandonment of 20% or more of our citizens because they don't have insurance. What a horrific and ignorant thing to say! There is no rationing going on for people who have no insurance, they go without healthcare or they go to the emergency rooms and pay ten times or more what they would have to.
I keep hearing supposed experts trying to sound moderate and fair by acknowledging the points of both sides but in reality the Uber Republican puppets of the wealthy are so far to the right, and so unreasonable and unrealistic that acknowledging their most acceptable points makes these experts seem irrational and idiotic.
Where is the common sense?
Great show! I've been a registered ultrasound and x-ray tech for 15 years, have worked across the U.S., worked with the Commonwealth nurses doctors, and visited hospitals in England and Canada. These healthcare professionals like their single-payer systems back home. And it's becoming harder to recruit them to come to the States. Who would want to leave home and the benefits of free healthcare, free medicine, and no insurance premiums to pay? Here, Canadian and English nurses make higher incomes but have to pay into expensive health insurance programs, and then get denied services, increased copays and reduced access, and the wait is longer because pre-approval slows it all down. It's just not worth it anymore. When quality family healthcare is free and available, why ever leave home?
The current U.S. 'for-profit' model is the least efficient with the poorest outcomes of all developed nations, while also being the most expensive. The European model is alot less expensive and has much better health outcomes.
We've been cutting Medicare and the V.A. funding for 20 years.
Imagine the billions of dollars we would save if the 'for-profit' was removed.
Rural healthcare is dying off in the U.S. heartland.
Physicians are no longer seeing Medicare patients.
Still, hospital board members quietly vote themselves 5-figure Christmas bonuses each year
Thank you Vermont for having the intelligence to do this.
Thanks to Diane, her Producers and staff for doing this remarkable story.
Good point Dewayne. Singapore also has an effective means of curbing frivilous medical malpractice lawsuits. As I understand it, it's a '3 strikes your out' system. A barrister (lawyer) approaches the claims review bench (3 judges in white powered wigs) and pitches the alledged harm done upon his client. If it is serious enough to go forward, then it goes forward. However if it is deemed frivilous, then the barrister may approach the bench TWO more times for a medical malpractice suit. Once the barrister is denied a claim three times, he is removed and can no longer represent clients before the bench. In effect, with three fivilous lawsuits, the barrister loses his license to practice. Is there medical malpractice in Singapore? Certainly. I think this review board is based similiar on the English Commonwealth system. When the state pays and controls the healthcare system, it also imposes strict sanctions against those who try to test the system. This way only the most agregious medical malpractice cases go before the bench, and even these cases can take years to resolve. The Singapore legal system is slooooow. But the citizens overall enjoy a great healthcare system....
The real reason for the rising cost of health care is not who pays. It's the immense costs themselves. Yes, insurance companies make sweetheart deals with hospitals that result in huge costs being pushed onto those without insurance. That's like being in line behind someone in the supermarket who uses food stamps and being made to pay extra. In fact, one local (Orlando) hospital charges $12,000 per HOUR for the O.R. - and that's just the room. We've all heard about the $40 aspirin, the $5,000 splinter removal. This is nothing less than organized crime against the most vulnerable, the sick and the injured who have no choice. We need sane prices in hospitals and doctors' offices, and then the question of rising health care costs will be rendered moot. As to the insurance companies, they've earned their extinction in my opinion through their placing of profit above life and health. My family experienced this personally. As the good governor says, health care should be a right, not a privilege.
Answer?: They don't. Being from Canada, we find the American system of healthcare aborrent....we don't seek it out. Try to better filter the falsehoods that your conservatives keep feeding you. In Toronto, we find that many Americans come here to get better treatments...and your seniors are still getting more affordable prescriptions filled from here as well.