Fertility's Legal Issues
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2010-08-16/fertilitys-legal-issues
Advances in assisted reproductive technology have multiplied options for people wanting to have a baby. But the law has not kept up with the science. The new legal and ethical frontiers of modern parenthood.
Guests
Richard Vaughn
Managing Attorney of the National Fertility Law Center
Dr. Paul Gindoff
Professor of Obstetrics & Gynecology at the George Washington University Medical Center and Director of The Fertility & IVF Center at The GW Medical Faculty Associates.
Kimberly Leighton
Assistant Professor of Philosophy at American University
Maureen McBrien
a lawyer at Todd & Weld in Boston, MA, co-author of "Assisted Reproductive Technology: A Lawyers Guide to Emerging Law and Science," and adjunct professor at Suffolk University Law School.
Comments
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What Maureen means with legal parents: Does gays couples consider legal parents?
Thanks
This is utter insanity. If you cannot afford to raise a child in your current situation then don't waste money on artificial insemination and then file for social security which moves the financial responsibilty of raising the child from the parent (responsible party) to the party who does not want to be responsible (the taxpayer).
What about cases like Nadya Sulemain, the single, unemployed woman who chose to be inseminated with 8 embryo's for a total of 14 children? How can she afford to take care of them? Isn't the doctor under some legal code of conduct even if the "mom" isn't?
Please ask your guest about the possibility of chimerism in the invitro procedure.
It is my hope that the guests will discuss the role of insurance companies in the field of reproductive technology, particularly as the amount that the insurance company may choose to reimburse may significantly reduce the choices available to couples who may not otherwise be able to reproduce.
Diane it sounds very frankenstein too me and I am glad I was conceived the old fashion way and what is even scarier to me is designer babies! Yikes!
I am wondering how "accidental incest" is prevented when using donors? Or perhaps consanguinity?
Fatherhood is a biological function accomplished by intercourse or artificial means. If a husband dies during intercourse, and the wife becomes pregnant, does she have to prove that she was impregnated prior to death for the husband to be recognized as the legal father? What is the legal status of two children who result from artificial insemination; one being performed 1 minute prior to the father's death, and one being performed 1 minute after the father's death? In all cases, the father is the father, why are we discussing otherwise?
Please ask Ms. McBrien about the legal rights of religiously based embryo donation agencies that prohibit the intended mother from "selectively reducing" the number of embryos should 2 or more embryos implant in the intended mother's uterus. Does the agency's rights supersede the patient's right to make reproductive decisions privately with her doctor?
Your guests commented on reproductive right and then said they did not believe in screening or "judging" the potential mother based upon this "right."
The inability to reproduce could be described as a disability, could it not? How does applying the "right" to reproduce through artificial means relate to other disabilities?
What about the right of the child to have a parent that is healthy and, say, financially able to support it? (Octamom, comes to mind) How do you weigh that against this "right' to reproduce?
Thank you.
As to screening people for parenthood, no facility would sell services to a 13 year old girl, would they? So at some level we do decide these things.
What steps are being taken for fertility treatments to be more available, financially for middle America? Why did your panel imply that infertility in lower income women is often a result of poor medical care? I am "lower income" in that our household income is about 45K. I am infertile and not because of poor medical care or not taking care of myself. I cannot afford fertility treatment. It is unfair that addiction treatment and birth control is free or covered by insurance.
I am a parent of two boys who were adopted...it is their RIGHT, not a privilege to know their birth origins. My husband and I have worked hard at helping our children understand their birthstories. We continue to maintain relationships with their birthfamilies so our children will have access to these family members as they need them.
All of the adults in the fertility arena talk about the issues surrounding the many different ways families are made today; however, no one is talking about the issues from a child-centered point of view...anonymity is not the best thing for the children who are being brought into this world. I assume most of the adults on Diane's show today can trace their family trees. Children who are brought into this world via sperm/egg donors, adoption, etc. deserve to know as much as humanly possible about their family trees as well. The parents and donors in these situations need to put their needs aside and think of giving their children that information in developmentally-appropriate ways. One celebrity-musician who was adopted stated it well (as I paraphrase)..."Most people get to start with Chapter 1 of their life story and children who are adopted (or brought into this world via non-traditional means) are expected to be satisfied with beginning their life stories at Chapter 2." Is that justice?
The example of the gay couple who did not want to know which of them had paternity of their child is a perfect example. I do not believe these two men are thinking of their child when they made the decision not to find out - that decision was made for the them, their comfort level, their needs. Their child deserves to know his/her biological roots whether or not his/her fathers want to know.
AT WHAT POINT DOES MAKING A FAMILY NEED TO BE FOCUSED ON THE CHILDREN BEING MADE AND TAKEN AWAY FROM THE PARENTS WHO ARE MAKING THEM?
If you get to pick the sperm doner's IQ you will have a good chance that he is going to be well off. Some may count on that for the future. Can you donate the frozen eggs only years after the doner's death so they can never get part of an estate? I have read stories of the young intern who had almost 20 plus offspring due to his physical/health discription and IQ. He could go broke if they all came back for his income.
I disagree with the preconception that most people using A.I. are designing a baby. My husband and I have been trying (unsuccessfully) for many years to have a child of our own. We have been saving for 3 years to try to save enough money for even 1 invitro attempt!
I like this show but I must comment politely that I find it frustrating listening to Diane's slow speaking style in contrast to the speed her guests speak. Can it be sped up?
First of all, I'd like to clearly state that I am in favor of gay/lesbian couples parenting. My brother and his husband are the parents of a now 15 year old daughter they have raised since she was 1 year old. She is a happy, healthy, well-adjusted teenager who has contact with her birth mother. I believe that any couple, gay or straight, should be able to have a child via surrogacy if it can be done ethically and safely for all parties. As someone on today's show said, these children are wanted! You have to want a child to try this hard.
My objection as a 55 year old feminist is to the Connecticut case discussed where the surrogate was not on the birth certificate at all! This is reverting back to the very bad old days we as women have struggled so hard to overcome when women were nothing more than a vessel for childbearing. This is abhorrent to me and should be to all feminists, male and female!
Hi pnews9,
My daughter was conceived with both IVF and a gestational carrier (not using the carrier's eggs) due to my having a series of miscarriages caused by a deformity in my reproductive system. I'm sorry if I or my daughter remind you of the Frankenstein story, however, when much of today's medicine was new, people sometimes reacted with similar resistance and skepticism. (There are so many examples, including vaccines, x-rays, robotic prostheses, penicillin -- the list is really endless.)
I had to take a tremendous leap in order to accept this medical treatment when multiple attempts of carrying a baby failed (as well as adoption failures, though this is a medical issue and I believe I deserve treatment). This woman's story is similar to mine, and it helped me to move in the direction of what finally brought my living child to me:
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/15227236
As for designer babies, that is mainly a fiction perpetrated by a media that sensationalizes egg donation as a treatment for women whose eggs are damaged by cancer treatment, hormone abnormalities, and other (sometimes mysterious) reasons.
I'm glad you are proud of your origins, but please realize that the children of folks who, with a great deal of love motivating them, had to endure a great deal of pain in order to bring their children into their families, are also proud of theirs.
Thanks for considering the point of view of someone who has not asked for this medical condition, and feels blessed to have had compassionate medical folks and an amazing woman step in to help.
Sincerely,
Vanessa
Hello, sdig1000,
Your points are quite valid, though stated a bit too didactically. Though I did not use donor egg, I wanted to respond because I went down the adoption route in China's program with no success. I then turned to Guatemala's program and discovered that there was a diabolical black market involving kidnappings. Needless to say, I lost heart to say the very least after a many years long desire for building my family when I heard such horrific and criminal practices existed that exploited children and families.
The question of origins, as you say here, is not something you can necessarily gloss over. However, your statement regarding "all of the adults in the infertility arena" not examining the child's point of view is simply inaccurate. There are far too many extraordinary parents of children born this way whom I have seen up close in the support networks to which I belong to be agree with blanket statements about what these parents are doing to raise their children with consideration and acknowledgment, even as it may sometimes be a challenge. The love I have seen for these children, as well, appears to have a deep and transformative grace about it that I find moving.
Though it seems you have done a wonderful job working to generously give your sons a life full of family all around, I think you likely know well that is not always possible. Your sons are very fortunate (even as some might imagine your arrangement might lead to confusion and loyalty conflicts, I think, managed well, it can be very healthy).
I believe if you would like to address an issue like this, becoming accusatory (such as you did in your last all-caps sentence of outrage) just doesn't foster understanding or increased dialogue. The folks whom you are yelling at, know that they are not what you paint them as, and they tune out. Others, who don't know any better, might raise their fists alongside you, but that doesn't really lead to any solutions, either.
Better, I think, to approach the folks sincerely and respectfully ask, "How do you overcome the challenge of your child's origins sometimes involving the donation of genetic material on an emotional, spiritual, and moral level?"
I get tired of our "gotcha" and "tune in to be outraged" media culture, and I think sometimes otherwise kind and well-meaning people get caught up in that on these types of forums. Your accusatory message hurts people who don't deserve it.
My husband and I were quite frustrated by your guests' stance that it is unethical to judge a prospective parent's ability to care for and financially support a child before undergoing fertility procedures. When we adopted our daughter we were required to cooperate - and rightly so - with home inspections, criminal background checks, financial investigation and group sessions, as well as providing many letters of recommendation from friends and colleagues. I do not understand why a physician would be ethically bound to assist a destitute or mentally ill woman, with no apparent financial or emotional ability to nurture a child, in a quest for parenthood.
Congratulations on the creation of your family, oma89.
There are similarities, of course, but there are also clear distinctions between adoption and a medical service. One is very much a social services process between interested parties and organizations providing social services--the other involves reproductive medical treatment for a patient, typically for a diagnosis that is covered for protection from discrimination under the Americans with Disabilities Act.
You might ask parents who were treated by OB/GYN's how they might feel if their treatment for their pregnancies involved a criminal background check. That would be a far more appropriate comparison, as adoption is not a medical treatment. (I am actually attempting to recall another medical diagnosis that, for treatment, requires a criminal background check and I am coming up empty so far.)
Each state differs, Effie, regarding how the birth certificate is handled. As someone who is using a gestational carrier who is appalled when someone thinks of her or refers to her as the mom, I thought I should weigh in on your comment.
I saw my carrier red in the face mad at a nurse for this once. After the nurse left, she was all flustered as she told me that she resented people foisting this title and role on her, as it both demeans and diminishes the role she does have, and causes her to feel as if people think she should feel like a mother to my child. She said it happened a lot, and she hated the term "surrogate mother" or "surrogate mom" and preferred either just "surrogate" or, even better was when folks knew the term used in the treatment realm: "gestational carrier," or "carrier."
You seem to take issue with the idea of a woman as a vessel for childbearing, yet, this is exactly what a gestational carrier is (in the very best, most nurturing sense of the word) and I will tell you that it is quite obvious when you spend any length of time around these women that they are darn proud of that role.