Environmental Outlook: Intelligence Under the Sea
http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2010-08-03/environmental-outlook-intelligence-under-sea
Toni Frohoff, Director of TerraMar Research, studying a wild dolphin in Irish Seas
Ute Margreff
Whales and dolphins are the animals closest to humans in their mental, social and behavioral complexity. As part of our ongoing Environmental Outlook Series, we take a look at what recent research tells us about intelligence under the sea.
Guests
Naomi Rose
Senior Scientist for Humane Society International, specializing in international marine mammal protection issues.
Toni Frohoff
Director of TerraMar Research and co-author of the book, "Dolphin Mysteries: Unlocking the Secrets of Communication."
Janet Mann
Professor of Psychology and Biology at Georgetown University, director of the Shark Bay Dolphin Research Project and author of the book "Cetacean Societies: Field studies of dolphins and whales."
Lori Marino
Senior Lecturer in Neuroscience and Behavioral Biology at Emory University in Atlanta, studies evolution of the brain and intelligence in cetaceans and primates.
Comments
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Dolphins and whales lack traits that are possessed by birds. Dr.Irene Pepperberg has shown, using African Gray Parrots that not only can they communicate in English, but that they have syntax.
When I see a dolphins communicate in English and with syntax, I will be convince.
Perhaps the killer whales pushing dead salmons near humans were trolling for humans, knowing how much we like our salmon.
Please comment on the 'fourth lobe', the part of the cetacean brain (dolphins/whales are cetaceans) that no other creatures have evolved. Humans only have three, and earlier evolved creatures like fish and reptiles/amphibians have only two or one. Whales create nothing, but they live effortlessly. They have long lives. Perhaps they have highly evolved social systems. Perhaps whale songs are their way of retelling their 'history of the world' since they can't write it, reciting it like the Australian aboriginals recite their oral history. I find it most interesting that whales evolved from hippo-like mammals that went back to the sea from being land creatures. After that, then the fourth brain lobe appeared, but only in them. Your thoughts? THANKS! I've been waiting for this exact story. Wendy White of Sundance near Raleigh NC.
Not to trivialize your discussion, but have either of your guests read David Brin's Uplift series? Science fiction but oh so very much to point.
These animals are so intelligent, we must get them out of captivity and back in the ocean.
Dolphins playfully accompanied our sailboat on several occasions during an Atlantic crossing last year. I previously had seen them from ships while serving in the Navy, but this experience where they were just a few feet from us for long periods was very memorable. Good program, Thanks
There's been discussion indicating we cannot easily release captive dolphins. How is it that dolphins become captive in the first place? Are they captured from the wild?
Hello Naomi, and to all of your guests - I worked with orcas in the wild for nearly 20 years and did scientific observations of orcas in captivity as well and can say with a pretty high level of certainty that orcas do not belong in captivity, that they do become bored, stressed, and, on occasion, will act out in ways that are dangerous to both themselves and the humans that work with them. In 18 years of observations, I only witnessed one act of aggression among orcas. It was directed to another orca, neither was injured, and it was minor in comparison to the behaviors seen by captive orcas. Orcas live in stable family groups for their entire life, including the adult males who assist the maternal group with watching the young, finding food, and socializing with other pods. To keep Tillicum and other orcas in a confined space similar to solitary confinement for humans is wrong, not healthy for the orcas, and creates a potentially dangerous situation. The educational value of captive orcas peaked many years ago when we knew little about them and today's "shows" are little more than entertainment for our enjoyment. Very little benefit, if any, for the orcas follows as a result of these charades. Much more educational value could be obtained from experiencing an IMAX type experience with live sound and video of wild orca populations with a naturalist on hand to describe what the audience is experiencing. This is possible today and would be much more interesting than watching a whale jump for a fish. We seriously need to reconsider our relationship with dolphins and whales. Thank you. - David Briggs
PS - Hi Naomi, from an old orca researcher friend of years past.
Requiring other species to communicate in any human language, let alone a specific one, is setting a very high standard indeed. Dolphins (not to mention dogs and any number of other species) actually understand English (and other language) commands quite well - when WE understand what the dolphins are saying, we might finally be entitled to this kind of egocentric expectation. As for syntax, dolphins do understand it - there have been several "language acquisition" studies with captive dolphins and it's clear they understand word placement in a command/sentence. In the one hour of the show, we unfortunately couldn't mention all the science out there on these fascinating animals
This kind of anthropocentric comment suggests we didn't succeed in making at least some of the audience understand a main point I at least was trying to make - that we understand very little about just how dolphin intelligence works. We know a little bit and that astounds us - but what we DON'T know, including what their complex vocalizations actually MEAN, could fill volumes. We are the ignorant ones here.
Many dolphins that are found in captive facilities around the world are still captured from the wild. Many are also bred in captivity (the US has been more successful at this than anywhere else, but still doesn't have a self-sustaining captive dolphin population). Some species reproduce more readily in captivity than others as well.
Naomi, don't despair. You absolutely got your point across to me and I'm sure to all the other listeners who realize that there are several intelligent species on this planet besides humans and parrots. I thought this show was wonderful.
What a fantastic show--my thanks to all these experts for sharing this necessary information.
To read more on these issues which feature the research and information of all of these experts, visit RekindlingTheWaters.com
Its time for our relationship with dolphins to evolve into something more appropriate and respectful.
Excellent show. Thank you so much.